An honest opinion - PLEASE

[Kev@ITK]

Hi guys

New to the forum obviously...

In a nutshell, i'm a 30% partner in a new venture, responsible for all things 'admin' which at this point will include everything website/forum based. I would like to add at this point I am an accountant by trade so spredsheets are the depth of my computer related talents!!

Our site will begin as a forum and in time turn into a full site, with the forum being just a part of it. By that time we'd hope to take on someone more advanced in the field but for now it's just me. We're a revenue based forum so will be looking for site sponsors as well as wanting to incorporate an online shop 6-12 months down the line (either our own stock or as a reseller).

On the face of it, I would like:

• Strong Facebook/Twitter links (although I would ideally like the forum to use the 'flat' format instead of the 'threaded' approach social networking seems to be taking these days as I find it very hard to follow content this way.
• Blogging
• Live chat (not essential as wonder if this takes away from forum content?)
• Full website incorporating an online shop (would want the forum users to be able to purchase direct from the shop so everything would need to be fully integrated)
• User friendly (both for the end user and for me as the responsible admin!)

I'm sure there is more but that's all I can remember for now. Oh yeah, there's likely to be plenty of pics/vids flying about so a slick way to organise those would be great too.

I was originally all set to buy vBull but version 5 BETA has really put me off and the more I reseach vB in general now the more i'm put off. I'm now edging towards either XF or IPB.

I fully appreciate this is a XF forum but would also appreciate your valued HONEST opinions based on my requirements? I'm not asking you to slag one option or the other, just help me spend our pennies wisely!

Many thanks in advance...

Kev

 

[Kev@ITK]

Thats why I said i'd do it Its a win win situation!

Ha, good recovery...

Might as well post this in here than anywhere else: given i'm a COMPLETE newbie to all of this, is there any particular bedtime reading I should be getting up to speed with to help with the basics? I literally don't understand what you lot are talking about half the time!

 

[Morgain]

Um Kev I just thought the importer to IPB will only transfer over user accounts, usergroups, forums, threads, messages, profile info on users, private messages. Not sure on signatures.

It will not transfer stuff on addons like gallery pics/ blogs/ albums but there may be workarounds.

 

[Morgain]

Ha, good recovery...

Might as well post this in here than anywhere else: given i'm a COMPLETE newbie to all of this, is there any particular bedtime reading I should be getting up to speed with to help with the basics? I literally don't understand what you lot are talking about half the time!

Keep dem questions coming mate!

 

[Kev@ITK]

Um Kev I just thought the importer to IPB will only transfer over user accounts, usergroups, forums, threads, messages, profile info on users, private messages. Not sure on signatures.

It will not transfer stuff on addons like gallery pics/ blogs/ albums but there may be workarounds.

Wow, thanks!! Can I get you 'reps' on here or is it all likes?

I was thinking exactly the same and this is what i'm edging my partner towards: starting with XF now and making the switch at a later date if necessary. My only concern there is if i'm learning this thing from the ground up, will I then need to learn all over again if I make the switch? I guess the IPB inner workings will differ but if I manage to pick up any general techy knowledge along the way (heaven forbid!), this could still be applied.

Not being able to transfer pics/albums would be a bummer though so this is something i'll have to ask around on before I take the plunge.

 

[John]

Might as well post this in here than anywhere else: given i'm a COMPLETE newbie to all of this, is there any particular bedtime reading I should be getting up to speed with to help with the basics? I literally don't understand what you lot are talking about half the time!

You might find some good reading here: http://products.sitepoint.com/ Not sure if they will have anything specifically on forums but they have great resources to choose from.

 

[CTXMedia]

Just to clarify Kevin - is the forum part of a wider site/venture - you know, a support forum for a software product ... or are your forums going to be your "site" and therefore your product (advertising space/premium memberships/etc.)?

If it's just forums, unless you make a massive investment in advertising or have some really good marketing expertise and a ready audience, you're not going to see fantastic growth in the first 12-18 months and so you may be over egging the pudding with all the worrying and to'ing and fro'ing you're doing.

Put simply, the best way to learn how to operate forums is to crack on and build them. You can plan for months but unless you get the site built and get people to it all your time is going to be wasted.

So what's the basic "business" idea (without giving anything private/classified away)?

Cheers,
Shaun

 

[Kev@ITK]

It will be part of a wider site venture over the long term but the forum will a) be our initial tool to target traffic and b) will pretty much always form the core of what we'll be doing - bums on seats so to speak is key (well, bums that chat/interact actually!)

I currently have two partners (one equity, one not) who are both extremely well connected within our target niche and should be able to drive reasonable numbers to the site within the first quarter of going live. My equity partner is also in talks with somebody with vast branding/marketing experience so it's very possible she'll be coming on board too. I would expect a small amount of advertising revenue and premium section subscriptions to start filtering through by mid next year but i'd say we're realistically looking at the back end before anything worth while shows its face. By that time we'll also be looking to implement our own store hence my need to keep one eye on the future.

There are LOTS of ideas floating around and the plans are fairly big over the next year or two but for now it's all about the forum.

PS thanks for all your help so far...

 

[psTubble27]

Make sure you temper expectations then and settle in for the long haul: as has already been said, the first 6 months will be the most difficult, and most of the referrals your partners will provide will initially not result in conversion to forum users -- simply because no one likes to be where others are not. It's what all forums have to go through. If you manage your partners' expectations, you guys should be finest the long run.

 

[Morgain]

Wow, thanks!! Can I get you 'reps' on here or is it all likes?
I was thinking exactly the same and this is what i'm edging my partner towards: starting with XF now and making the switch at a later date if necessary. My only concern there is if i'm learning this thing from the ground up, will I then need to learn all over again if I make the switch? I guess the IPB inner workings will differ but if I manage to pick up any general techy knowledge along the way (heaven forbid!), this could still be applied.
Not being able to transfer pics/albums would be a bummer though so this is something i'll have to ask around on before I take the plunge.

Na I'm just a motherly type - my people call me Clan Mother.
The twio systems have the same basics. You'd learn how to manage the admin side (the backend) on things like usergroups - these aer groups you create with permissions to do various things like use private messaging or have access to special areas.
The general principle is the same but the way the two boar4ds do it is different. XF is easier to handle. Natch!
So yes you'd have to learn a different system on the details.
Yes you'd pick up quite a bit of techy knowledge on the way. A lot of it is fun.

As noted above you won't have a huge membership right away. It's always upward climbing to build membership. So while it';s small making changes is no big deal.
When I transferred from Vbulletin to IPB I lost the users albums. But it was a small userbase so I just copied their pics into named folders on my pc and did the transfer for them individually. It's worth it to get the delighted reactions.

I'm curious too to know your line in general. Not asking for state secrets and if it's porn forget it.

 

[Kev@ITK]

Na I'm just a motherly type - my people call me Clan Mother.
The twio systems have the same basics. You'd learn how to manage the admin side (the backend) on things like usergroups - these aer groups you create with permissions to do various things like use private messaging or have access to special areas.
The general principle is the same but the way the two boar4ds do it is different. XF is easier to handle. Natch!
So yes you'd have to learn a different system on the details.
Yes you'd pick up quite a bit of techy knowledge on the way. A lot of it is fun.

As noted above you won't have a huge membership right away. It's always upward climbing to build membership. So while it';s small making changes is no big deal.
When I transferred from Vbulletin to IPB I lost the users albums. But it was a small userbase so I just copied their pics into named folders on my pc and did the transfer for them individually. It's worth it to get the delighted reactions.

I'm curious too to know your line in general. Not asking for state secrets and if it's porn forget it.

Ha it's not porn, don't think i'd struggle for members if it was and there would likely be too much media to transfer elsewhere manually!!!

 

[Kev@ITK]

Kev I was just thinking that as the ultra safe option you could go with XF and if necessary later import to IPB.
An importer is just a program to transfer all your existing users, usergroups, permissions, posts to another forum tpe.
But it does need to be a specifically created program for that purpose. It will tell you exactly how to do it. Or you can get a helper.

I'm sure IPB has an XF importer by now - does anyone know?

No we wouldn't say there is no need. Those of us who advise you to consider XF seriously are even so aware that the real world is never totally predictable. So there's a small possibility of it all going titsup. We're not a sales team trying to drag you in just for your money. We want the best package for you and right now that means a backup plan just in case.
You need to feel relaxed and happy using XF to get the best out of it. Security of mind is essential.

Hmmm...I just had a reverse brainwave style moment: would it possibly be better to go with IPB first, use their hosted plan (no licence fee) and see what happens with XF over the next few months? I presume then if things went well with XF the import over would be just the same as the other way (?) and if not then a) we'd be all set with a 'long-term' product b) i'd have learnt the more difficult backend of the two and c) my members wouldn't miss the cool XF features as they'd never have known anything different!!

 

[MagnusB]

I'd think the choice you make now, you should stick with. Members don't like frequent change.

 

[Kev@ITK]

Just to bring some kind of closure to this thread for anyone who cares - I think i've made my mind up to go with IPB for the time being. It's not my preference in terms of 'forum experience' but it does seem to be the more sensible approach given the situation. We're building a business here after all and XF is giving me no real sign that they can support that vision for the long term (owners - not mods - if you want my custom, come out and tell me otherwise).

I'll be keeping an eye on the board for updates yet I fear a miraculous recovery, even if it should happen, could be a long drawn out affair. I appreciate there's likely to be more going on behind the scenes than meets the eye but as a business owner there's nothing more important to me than keeping people in the loop. Watching a) potential new customers questioning whether they should buy and b) good quality third party developers turning their back on XF is not something you'd allow to happen, simple.

Anyway, i've REALLY enjoyed being on this board more than any other and the help has been exceptional from you guys. I've got everything crossed for the future, believe me...

Kev

 

[SchmitzIT]

Good luck with your venture, Kevin. Should you change your mind, we're here to help out.

Your line of thought is totally understandable. I'll leave it at that.

 

[Morgain]

Kev your thinking is very wise and a thoughtful admin like you is our loss. I look forward to seeing you return.

 

[Slavik]

Demos are back online.

 

[Mert]

Kev I was just thinking that as the ultra safe option you could go with XF and if necessary later import to IPB.

Jesus , how on earth can you suggest something like that. You guys are really pushing things terrible to get people invest in Xenforo.

@Kevin , decision is up to you , as Shelly suggested make sure you try everything and make a decision afterwards. However keep in mind on established sites changing URL structure is NEVER a good thing. You should try not to switch boards constantly as on each switch all your existing URLs will be broken.

Make your choice wisely if it is a business investment you are going to enter.

 

[petertdavis]

Um Kev I just thought the importer to IPB will only transfer over user accounts, usergroups, forums, threads, messages, profile info on users, private messages. Not sure on signatures.

It will not transfer stuff on addons like gallery pics/ blogs/ albums but there may be workarounds.

It currently doesn't import private messages.

 

[kkm323]

Kevin its good to hear from you and we respect and understand your decision

 

[Kev@ITK]

Thanks again guys.

I'm doing my best to make IPB seem 'XF-like' with hover/preview hooks etc but the user experience still falls short in my eyes. It does have some good features though and for now it's the safe bet....

Thanks for all the PM's too offering advice both ways, much appreciated!