XenForo 2.0 Discussion

[Chris D]

You're certainly not alone in that some people currently prefer the XF1 style over the XF2 style, though this is hardly unexpected. There will be some people who genuinely don't like it, but I would expect a majority of them will take their time to adjust to it, and at the end may prefer it.

That said, the feedback we've received so far suggests the people who prefer the XF1 style are in the minority.

Hardly scientific, but hopefully the results of this poll will be somewhat representative, and ultimately the margin will reduce as a) it grows on people and b) they find it easier to get the look and feel that they like for their own forum:

https://xf2demo.xenforo.com/threads/comparing-styles-between-xf1-and-xf2.1456/

 

[Doctor]

I find myself wondering if the reason why XF2 looks the way it does is because that plays better on a phone screen, and if the focus is on that. I realize mobile is certainly a big trend and hugely significant in society in general, but personally the last thing I would want to do in terms of forums is use them by phone. I'm a desktop guy. Give me a nice big keyboard to do real typing and a normal size screen. Or is that not it?

 

[Pierce]

I find myself wondering if the reason why XF2 looks the way it does is because that plays better on a phone screen, and if the focus is on that. I realize mobile is certainly a big trend and hugely significant in society in general, but personally the last thing I would want to do in terms of forums is use them by phone. I'm a desktop guy. Give me a nice big keyboard to do real typing and a normal size screen. Or is that not it?

Maybe not all forums are mobile dominated, but the computer sales has been telling big brand names that sell computers, tablets and phones that it is tablet and mobile. Tablet barely registers as a traffic margin for me. But it outsold desktops. Mobile is 60-80% depending on the market. Some forums, read by computer admins are desktop orientated.

Apples latest laptop offering demonstrates their focus is not on laptops.

Mass market = mass device = mobile phones. Android / iPhone is almost 50/50 (iphone is more popular) on my forum.

I think the xenforo developers are going in the right direction. Anyhow if you don't like the default theme as said before plenty of people making good themes to suit your niche.

But oh I don't want to have to pay for one! But oh there should be more devs for xenforo! Pick one. Hide the other.

 

[Doctor]

Well I certainly would not say it's bad either, and as I suggested above perhaps I could come to like it, and as Chris suggested perhaps I could be among those who adjust to it. That certainly seems possible for me. Maybe months from now I'll be saying how I like it. It certainly also does have some positive qualities in my view despite not being my first preference overall for style. And if there was a theme that I liked which worked well then all the better if it's not a problem or too expensive.

As far as mobile goes - it's clear that many people use that for Facebook, for example. On FB, you generally have short, clipped, terse commenting and joking. With some exceptions, or partial exceptions, you almost never have real discussion or real conversation, which is what a forum is for. Is there evidence to suggest that people like to use mobile for a real forum that uses software like XF the way they like to use it for something like FB? While I'm not a "millennial" anymore in terms of age and haven't been for years, for instance, I can honestly say that if people were walking around with smartphones they way they do now when I was, I still would never have wanted to be doing things like that on a phone or a tablet. To me that would not be enjoyable. What would be enjoyable to me is what I'm doing now, which is sitting at a desk with a full size monitor and a real keyboard to do real typing, and a UI style that has a little pleasant visual richness and depth as this UI has without going overboard. Laptop users also count as "desktop" in that sense. In fact, I would also like a little more richness and depth in that department, so there is room for more with me without going overboard yet. That's actually also one of the things I have always liked about VB as a forum user too.

(And look at all that I typed here - that's not even a super long forum post. But isn't that a lot to do on a phone or tablet?)

 

[CarpCharacin]

Why isn't utf8mb4 support automatically added during the upgrade to XF 2? How do you go about adding it after the upgrade? Can it be added on XF 1?

 

[Chris D]

Because it's entirely optional and dependent on being able to use a MySQL version that supports it.

It's also a potentially intensive operation so the process is run from the command line:

php cmd.php xf:convert-utf8mb4

No, we won't be adding support to XF1.

 

[CarpCharacin]

This won't be a problem for me since I have a VPS, but how will sites that are on shared hosting that don't have shell access add support for utf8mb4?

 

[Chris D]

It might be something we add a UI for eventually, but the current process (and therefore the process people will use during the dev preview) is to use the CLI (which you will need for the install anyway).

Just to be clear; the installer will automatically apply utf8mb4 if it is supported for clean installs, but, again, the CLI will be needed during the dev preview if it is installed before your environment supports utf8mb4.

It's also worth noting handling this in the upgrade is problematic as we can't necessarily distinguish between core XF tables and those added by add-ons, and we can't always guarantee a table added by an add-on will be convertible without error.

 

[Hoolio]

As far as mobile goes - it's clear that many people use that for Facebook, for example. On FB, you generally have short, clipped, terse commenting and joking. With some exceptions, or partial exceptions, you almost never have real discussion or real conversation, which is what a forum is for. Is there evidence to suggest that people like to use mobile for a real forum that uses software like XF the way they like to use it for something like FB? While I'm not a "millennial" anymore in terms of age and haven't been for years, for instance, I can honestly say that if people were walking around with smartphones they way they do now when I was, I still would never have wanted to be doing things like that on a phone or a tablet. To me that would not be enjoyable. What would be enjoyable to me is what I'm doing now, which is sitting at a desk with a full size monitor and a real keyboard to do real typing, and a UI style that has a little pleasant visual richness and depth as this UI has without going overboard. Laptop users also count as "desktop" in that sense. In fact, I would also like a little more richness and depth in that department, so there is room for more with me without going overboard yet. That's actually also one of the things I have always liked about VB as a forum user too.

I access my own and other forums 90% via mobile.

 

[Doctor]

I access my own and other forums 90% via mobile.

And you enjoy that and you're really 56? Are you talking phone or tablet? You must have great eyesight too, right? Do you know of other people who are not "millennials" who also like that? What kind of forum do you run?

 

[Martok]

And you enjoy that and you're really 56? Are you talking phone or tablet? You must have great eyesight too, right? Do you know of other people who are not "millennials" who also like that? What kind of forum do you run?

I'm not far off that age and I access forums much of the time via mobile device - mainly my 8" tablet but also my 4.3" Xperia compact phone. My eyesight is OK, I have distance glasses. I know many non-millenials who also mostly access forums with mobile devices, my gaming community is built around older gamers.

 

[Teapot]

And you enjoy that and you're really 56? Are you talking phone or tablet? You must have great eyesight too, right? Do you know of other people who are not "millennials" who also like that? What kind of forum do you run?

My Mum, who is also not a millennial, accesses the entire internet, including forums, through her smartphone - she hasn't used a desktop or laptop computer in years. The hard numbers are trending towards increased mobile usage across the board, from everything I've seen.

 

[Hoolio]

And you enjoy that and you're really 56? Are you talking phone or tablet? You must have great eyesight too, right? Do you know of other people who are not "millennials" who also like that? What kind of forum do you run?

Gadgets / music tech. But I have to say my use of the forum has changed, I am more in touch with a small admin team than in and out of threads as I used to be over the community's 14 year lifespan.

I have the varifocal lenses in my glasses "custom cut" . On mine I have the bottom (reading) edge raised by 3 mm. If i dont do that find the reading (or in my case, mobile phone) portion of the lens too narrow or "stingy". When I get a new pair of glasses the first thing I do is try to read my phone. Reading distant street signs is a lower priority...

I frequently get sniggers and laughs at how big I have the font on my phone's email and SMS (its big!)

I am a big fan of Lou Reed of the Velvet Underground rock group. He's dead now but for a while he had his own iPhone app called Lou Zoom. It displayed search results of contacts with only the first name last name and main phone number in HUGE font expanding every time to fill the entire screen. he created it because he was sick and tired of not being able to read tiny text. (Its discontinued now - shame!)

I'm not far off that age and I access forums much of the time via mobile device - mainly my 8" tablet but also my 4.3" Xperia compact phone. My eyesight is OK, I have distance glasses. I know many non-millenials who also mostly access forums with mobile devices, my gaming community is built around older gamers.

My Mum, who is also not a millennial, accesses the entire internet, including forums, through her smartphone - she hasn't used a desktop or laptop computer in years. The hard numbers trending towards increased mobile usage across the board, from everything I've seen.

When determining default font size for the forum I push it to the maximum possible that our younger audience might tolerate.

It does seem like an US v THEM situation (young vs old)

 

[Chris D]

My Mum, who is also not a millennial, accesses the entire internet, including forums, through her smartphone - she hasn't used a desktop or laptop computer in years. The hard numbers trending towards increased mobile usage across the board, from everything I've seen.

My Mum also has a smartphone. She also enjoys playing on her PlayStation 3 and is looking forward to getting a PS4.

 

[cellarius]

And you enjoy that and you're really 56? Are you talking phone or tablet? You must have great eyesight too, right? Do you know of other people who are not "millennials" who also like that? What kind of forum do you run?

I'm 40, so hardly a millenial, and yes, I use mobile devices (tablet and phone) a lot to access forums nowadays. With a good UI eysight is not a problem. You just need to adapt to the thought that things look different on mobile and you may not have all the options present all the time.

Also, many elderly people I know tend to have a smartphone now. Because of this, and exactly because they are not power users, they do not use computers anymore. They don't see why they should have and pay for a second device if their mobile device satisfies their needs.

 

[jmurrayhead]

My Mum, who is also not a millennial, accesses the entire internet, including forums, through her smartphone - she hasn't used a desktop or laptop computer in years. The hard numbers are trending towards increased mobile usage across the board, from everything I've seen.

I was going to say, my mother hasn't turned on her desktop in years. Everything is done over her smartphone now.

 

[RobinHood]

Son with a mum chiming in.

Mine uses her 6+ these days for most of her web browsing now that she's comfortable using it, using her laptop far less.

Same with my Dad now that I think about it, at least for casual web browsing and not using work applications.

It's fascinating how different generation use tech differently when introduced to it at different times and stages in their life.

My Dad responds to all texts and emails on his iPhone using dictation. For some reason it really surprised me when I found this out a while back. But it totally makes sense seeing as he adopted a smartphone (iPhone) quite late and never got used to typing fast on a screen.

But because he got one quite late, by the time he started using one, the dictation aspect had matured and the accuracy was very good.

After spending a week with him seeing how useful it was, I've started to use dictation quite a lot for replying to forum posts when on the move.

 

[Digital Doctor]

The good users post via the desktop
Smartphones are best for consuming the internets not adding to it.

Of course, I'm typing on my iPhone 7 plus, sitting beside my PC !

Maybe I'm wrong

 

[whynot]

Smartphones are best for consuming the internets not adding to it.

Bullseye!

 

[jmurrayhead]

The good users post via the desktop
Smartphones are best for consuming the internets not adding to it.

Of course, I'm typing on my iPhone 7 plus, sitting beside my PC !

Maybe I'm wrong

It really depends on the person. I'd venture that a lot of people are only interested in consuming these days. But when they do create content from there mobile devices, it's somewhere in the 144 character limit. Though, I do know people who create lengthy posts from their mobile device.

EDIT:

Posted from by self-built desktop