Update on XenForo development status?

[mrGTB]

That said, I think you have enough information to make an educated decision

What you really mean is an "educated guess", but it shouldn't be that way. No customer should be having to make an "educated decision (guess)", that's where regular announcements come into play taking away all guess work keeping them in the loop constantly to know what's what.

Xenforo, have an ongoing courtcase pending against them unlike most other software companies. Meaning it's even more important for them that they keep customers in the loop.

One of the most important thing in any business, never ever ignore your customers, lose one through your own fault and more than likely they've gone for good, not to mention the bad press they might give you losing you more customers!

 

[Shelley]

Personally, I think Brogan is very professional. That's all it matters to me. And I think he leaves this thread open so it gives a chance to others expressing themselves on the same subject who was closed on so many occasions (from what I read here). I really appreciate that and I believe deep down inside of him, he would like to read more about XenForo updates also.

As you probably noticed in this thread, I'm very harsh to stupid posts that waste everyone's time and also professional with people who post intelligent remarks. (whoaa first smilie I post in this thread)

Since you mentioned you are wanting word from the devs about development due to a 20,000 contract I'd assume you want to hear about development progressing. The only way of this being confirm is word from the devs. Everything in between is garbage and irrelevent to your question you want answered.

everything in between is getting boring the running around in circles is getting boring. A simple response would remedy this not for my sake, or half the people on here but for those that keep asking this question which is legitimate.

 

[Eric Russell]

What you really mean is an "educated guess", but it shouldn't be that way. No customer should be having to make an "educated decision (guess)", that's where regular announcements come into play taking away all guess work keeping them in the loop constantly to know what's what.

You need to stick to business and not get emotional over this.

They don't make announcements often. If this is something you can't handle then this isn't the solution for you.

I completely understand some people would like Mike and/or Kier to start a new thread titled "Is xenforo still in development and going strong?" With a quick post of "yes" or "no" by both of them and then lock it. They either don't want to do that or can't do that. Either way everyone has to make there best educated guess as to whether or not xenforo is for them.

 

[whynot]

I completely understand some people would like Mike and/or Kier to start a new thread titled "Is xenforo still in development and going strong?" With a quick post of "yes" or "no" by both of them and then lock it.

Adding oil to the fire.
A new thread in http://xenforo.com/community/forums/have-you-seen/ would be satisfactory.

 

[Eric Russell]

Adding oil to the fire.
A new thread in http://xenforo.com/community/forums/have-you-seen/ would be satisfactory.

Yes of course if you quote me out of context it would appear I'm adding fuel to the fire.

 

[John]

Is it just me or is there some sort of weird dynamic going on here at XF where you have one group always attacking another over things that shouldn't be fought over? Amazing, really. Why some feel the need to personally attack others for simply asking for a little information is bizarre. I feel sorry for K,M and A. I feel sorry for Paul and the rest of the moderators.

/* unsubscribes from thread */

 

[whynot]

Yes of course if you quote me out of context it would appear I'm adding fuel to the fire.

Sorry,Eric, instead of saying :

Adding oil to the fire.

I should have said: It would add oil to the fire.
I did not mean that you are giving oil to the fire.

 

[Shelley]

Is it just me or is there some sort of weird dynamic going on here at XF where you have one group always attacking another over things that shouldn't be fought over? Amazing, really. Why some feel the need to personally attack others for simply asking for a little information is bizarre. I feel sorry for K,M and A. I feel sorry for Paul and the rest of the moderators.

/* unsubscribes from thread */

Hence everything in between is garbage. And a simple "development is ongoing " by the devs would stop all this garbage which it is. Utter Garbage.

 

[Alien]

I'm someone who has always had shown support behind K/M/A, and not supported all of these redundant threads.

So coming from me this is unusual, but it is what it is... We need a development update ASAP. That simple.

If it were not under the lawsuit cloud, I'd make no such request as the time-frame between releases has NOT been long enough to concern me. The software is solid and no immediate release is needed. However, this is a special situation and a small statement on the state of continued development to end these concerns would suffice. The "Hello Again" thread was helpful, but it did not talk to the state of XenForo development or other developer absences which is concerning. If Mike elected to pull away from the forums for a bit, and focus on the software behind the scenes that's absolutely terrific. However everyone practically vanishing for months is a concern.

Please note I'm not asking for validation of our overall decision to use XenForo, we happily took the risk with purchasing (multiple) licenses because we believe in you guys regardless of the ultimate outcome against such a ludicrous lawsuit. We're just asking specifically about what stage XenForo development is currently in (since it was stated it continued), and what sort of delays we are looking at. Is Q2 still feasible?

It's been weeks since Kier came back, and I'm saddened by all the issues he's had to endure and wish I could help. But toss us a 'Scooby Snack', will ya?

 

[Eric Russell]

Is it just me or is there some sort of weird dynamic going on here at XF where you have one group always attacking another over things that shouldn't be fought over? Amazing, really. Why some feel the need to personally attack others for simply asking for a little information is bizarre. I feel sorry for K,M and A. I feel sorry for Paul and the rest of the moderators.

/* unsubscribes from thread */

LOL, I feel like I have the same thing happening at my site all the time. My members constantly try to rule the asylum. Best thing to do is not answer and let one of the moderators speak for me once in a while.

 

[Marc]

I'm someone who has always had shown support behind K/M/A, and not supported all of these redundant threads.

So coming from me this is unusual, but it is what it is... We need a development update ASAP. That simple.

If it were not under the lawsuit cloud, I'd make no such request as the time-frame between releases has NOT been long enough to concern me. The software is solid and no immediate release is needed. However, this is a special situation and a small statement on the state of continued development to end these concerns would suffice. The "Hello Again" thread was helpful, but it did not talk to the state of XenForo development or other developer absences which is concerning. If Mike elected to pull away from the forums for a bit, and focus on the software behind the scenes that's absolutely terrific. However everyone practically vanishing for months is a concern.

Please note I'm not asking for validation of our overall decision to use XenForo, we happily took the risk with purchasing (multiple) licenses because we believe in you guys regardless of the ultimate outcome against such a ludicrous lawsuit. We're just asking specifically about what stage XenForo development is currently in (since it was stated it continued), and what sort of delays we are looking at. Is Q2 still feasible?

It's been weeks since Kier came back, and I'm saddened by all the issues he's had to endure and wish I could help. But toss us a 'Scooby Snack', will ya?

Im the same to be honest. To the extent I am actually in the process of moving my forum away from xenforo.

The reasons for which are simple. I moved it to xenforo as it was moving forward with new inovation. I could see new things being added consistantly and on top of that the mod community was doing quite well also. This meant I was managing to get functionality back little by little through way of either xenforo product updates or 3rd party addons. Since the lack of activity from xenforo this has given a bit hit to the mod community also and some of the best addon coders have simply stopped from what I can see (some actually stating as much). Therefore I cannot move my forum forward.

I have kept hold of a xenforo licence, and I will be using it to start up a new forum. I do hope that the company succeeds and hope it does well for KAM. However for me its time for me to move my large forum off it an continue with it where there is more active development by both company and 3rd party community. Even if that wasnt really something I wanted to do.

Guys you really need to give people information that they want. All I can foresee at the moment is a complete loss of confidence by most, no attempt to recover it, and Brogan (from what I can see) sat in the middle which I personally see as being extremely unfair to him considering the excellent job he does on here.

 

[Astrum]

My question for people requesting a development update is why. If it's for a business decision then I would never base it on what isn't released. If XenForo doesn't have the feature set you need right now either officially or through well developed third party add-ons, then pick a different forum package that does. As much as I love XenForo and recommend it, if it doesn't meet your criteria, it's not the forum software for you. I know several people who run XenForo forums and it fits their needs perfectly. Anything that comes out in the future is icing on the cake (or bloat, depending on who you talk to, heh). The only thing you should be concerned about is the status of bugs, which XenForo has relatively few of. There are other reasons for inquiring about the development status, e.g. a developer wanting to know about the mobile skin to determine if they should push forward with their own mobile skin or hold off. This is a complicated area but understandable.

Most of these threads are doing an extreme disservice to the XenForo community. People who may want to use XenForo will come here and see all of these threads, many with crazy supposition, and think XenForo is dead, dying, etc... rather than deciding if XenForo fits their needs or not. If you want XenForo to succeed then it needs an active, supportive community. Not this.

 

[Digital Doctor]

All I can foresee at the moment is a complete loss of confidence by most

Are you sure ? I think you are off base. I think vBulletin is practically in free fall (vBorg feels like a ghost town). In contrast, xenforo continues to get stronger. Please read my take on things ...

To the extent I am actually in the process of moving my forum away from xenforo.
The reasons for which are simple. I moved it to xenforo as it was moving forward with new inovation. I could see new things being added consistently.

also and some of the best addon coders have simply stopped from what I can see (some actually stating as much). Therefore I cannot move my forum forward.

However for me its time for me to move my large forum off it an continue with it where there is more active development by both company and 3rd party community.

First off, let me discuss my credentials in the area of keeping track of developers and addons. I am the person whom has wined the most about xenforo's support for developers and their support of Xenforo addons. I have endured the wrath of K,A,M,B and the "party faithful" (Forsaken, King K, et. al.) for repeatedly complaining on this topic. My "mission" to get an Apple Apps type store here with Paid addons in the listing resulted in considerable backlash. You can consider me complainer #1 on the topic of "Addons". To be honest, I have watched and read most of the posts about every addon. Off the top of my head, I could probably tell you "the status" of almost every addon developer (sad, I know, but it nevertheless true).

So here is my take: The Addon community is getting stronger. The recent coders that have come are amongst the highest quality developers out there.

Whom I consider the recent recruits:

guiltar (Social Network Authentication (Twitter, Google, VK.com) + TMS templates + many others + others in pipeline)
vinavb ([******] Thread Tags)
Naatan (Template Syntax, Xenforo SSO)
Waindigo (Library by Waindigo)

These 4 are extra good and have made some great addons VERY recently.

Many of the longstanding members are still producing and supporting their addons:

xfrocks (Tag Me, Countless others)
Jaxel (XenPorta, XenMedio, etc.)
Darkimmortal - TaigaChat, Post Ratings, + more
Syndol (Bookmarks [Paid])
Russ (XFS Mobile Style)
Erik (Flexile)
Tilkißey + borbole - consistently produce helpful things.

Some of the longstanding members are back for more:
ragtek (Editor Templates [Paid])
Robbo (Simple Gallery)

We've also seen some excellent new Style Developers / tweakers:
cclaerhout (Advanced BBcodes Toolbar)
Matthew2D (Search This Thread)
TheVisitors (Tips and Guides)
Dinh Thanh (Automatic Style switcher).

We've got more and more people willing to do Xenforo work: SchmitzIT, Clickfinity.
Slavik and Deebs - and their ultra superb server knowledge.
Jake and Brogan (two best forum guys in the biz).

And last but certainly not least the Heavy Hitters: IGN and digitalpoint.

IGN - ign.com - still going strong on Xenforo.

digitalpoint (Change Analyzer For Enhanced Search 1.0)

5 days (and counting) for migration.

The bottom line: When you and your community are moving in a different direction than digitalpoint - you are most certainly going in the wrong direction. You can take one to the bank.

 

[Floren]

And a simple "development is ongoing" by the devs would stop all this garbage which it is.

I would not be satisfied with a "development is ongoing" reply.

My question for people requesting a development update is why.

Simple, I'm a customer and I would like to know how my 3 licenses ($920) investment is doing. I invested this cash based on what I was told in the beginning and right now this information flow stopped while the developers are not posting anymore. What stronger reason do you need?

Most of these threads are doing an extreme disservice to the XenForo community. People who may want to use XenForo will come here and see all of these threads, many with crazy supposition, and think XenForo is dead, dying, etc... rather than deciding if XenForo fits their needs or not. If you want XenForo to succeed then it needs an active, supportive community. Not this.

I don't think we are the ones who are doing a disservice to XenForo, those threads would not be created if answers would be provided in the first place. How do you explain why the none of developers posted any answers? What I fear the most is to see this thread closed with a vague answer "we are working on 1.2.0" which does not tell absolutely nothing about the direction XenForo is taking or how the software is shaping up for the next release.

Kier posted into his "Hello again" thread: "I can devote the necessary time and effort to focus on our great product and wonderful community." I would like to see this phrase transformed into reality because nearly one month later after his post there is no action going on and no info posted anywhere about XenForo development.

Personally, I support XenForo by paying them $920 and in return all I want is a little courtesy of getting development updates every month (which they offered in the beginning), the same way they want us to buy more licenses or renew the inactive ones. Is all about money after all, nothing is free in this world.

 

[p4guru]

I can see the debate from all sides here. The fact is though everyone looks out for #1 first - themselves which makes matters far more complicated.

1. Kier and folks have personal, legal and financial issues to deal with
2. Floren's concern would be the financial risk/loss of client contracts tied to xenforo development
3. Floren's potential clients (like other xenforo clients on this forum) would be concerned with their forums future under a xenforo powered forum

I can understand Floren's concern as I too stake my livelihood and finances consulting for some medium to large forums as well.

But look at this way, some of you are asking Kier and folks to put the priority of his clients (us) above his own immediate priorities and concerns.

For consultants/contractors such as Floren and myself, if asked the same of us - to put the priorities of our clients before our own priorities i.e. me getting paid $$$, would you or I tell our clients the honest truth at the risk of our own incomes and say "sorry I'd suggest you stick with your existing forum software for now. I don't recommend you migrate to xenforo yet due to the current development progress concerns ?"

So would you do what you're asking Kier to do ? put his clients before his own immediate priorities ?

For me, that's exactly what I do as it's the truth of the matter now. I tell my clients:

'do not do live migrations to xenforo yet, stick with what you're using... and since the xenforo license cost is a small drop in a bucket in terms of costs to these clients, i suggest they buy a xenforo license and do local internal testing in the mean time for when xenforo is ready. But not to do live forum migrations right now'

Reality of situation:
Honestly, i'm surprised everyone is getting their knickers in a knot as from the beginning of xenforo, you would of all (or most of you) have that tiny thought in the back of your mind - 'a 2 person development team for xenforo + on going legal issues + what 'if' unexpected health issues arise factors - would there be foreseen problems and delays down the track for future development ?' Of course there would be very likely to run into issues in future. This is that time now.

Of course we all jumped on the xenforo bandwagon wishing and hoping that such a situation doesn't become reality. We all want to be able to promote xenforo to the world as technical/coding wise it's awesome. But a commercial software package such as xenforo is part techinical and part business. And it's probably the underlying business side of things we are really concerned about with the lack of xenforo development status updates being the indicator.

I don't know about you folks, but I've experienced financially tight times myself, and during those times everything else takes a lower priority in life while I crawl out of that tight spot. Any and all actions I make during those times are to improve my financial position.

The request and announcement for a simple development status update really isn't a 100% guarantee of anything guys. Who's to say KAM's financial and legal situations take a turn for the worse. Which probably is inline with Astrum's statement which i agree with http://xenforo.com/community/threads/update-on-xenforo-development-status.30992/page-5#post-354145

My question for people requesting a development update is why. If it's for a business decision then I would never base it on what isn't released. If XenForo doesn't have the feature set you need right now either officially or through well developed third party add-ons, then pick a different forum package that does.

Personally, I'd say give Kier and folks a break and let them announce what they need to announce in their own time.

Everyone of us has to make a decision based on our own priorities and situation.

• For contractors like Floren and I, we would have to run our own business based on the reality of the situation and not what we wish for to happen.
• For xenforo customers the decision would be whether to stick with xenforo in it's current state and/or make backup plans for worse case scenarios. Just look at Shawn/Digitalpoint he's on vBulletin platform right now but he has backup plans in place for switch to xenforo if the situation arises. Same practical and common sense approach should be taken with xenforo.

 

[Floren]

I don't know about you folks, but I've experienced financially tight times myself, and during those times everything else takes a lower priority in life while I crawl out of that tight spot.

I'm in the same situation, very difficult financially.

Personally, I'd say give Kier and folks a break and let them announce what they need to announce in their own time.

I agree with your post except the above sentence. I would also agree with this sentence if I would see replies made by Kier and Mike into product related threads, like this one. None of the above happens currently.

 

[Floris]

They state:

XenForo Limited is a limited company registered in England and Wales with company number 07294282 and registered office at 24 Oak Tree Rd, Tilehurst, RG31 6JX.​

​

Give them a call? I mean, it's a business question right? If you do not get a response (to your satisfaction) you can always adapt to the market and focus on another product. You care bout your money, and they should care about theirs. You're not responsible for the way they handle their business.

 

[Andrej]

I can see the debate from all sides here. The fact is though everyone looks out for #1 first - themselves which makes matters far more complicated.

1. Kier and folks have personal, legal and financial issues to deal with
2. Floren's concern would be the financial risk/loss of client contracts tied to xenforo development
3. Floren's potential clients (like other xenforo clients on this forum) would be concerned with their forums future under a xenforo powered forum

I can understand Floren's concern as I too stake my livelihood and finances consulting for some medium to large forums as well.


But look at this way, some of you are asking Kier and folks to put the priority of his clients (us) above his own immediate priorities and concerns.

You miss one point. Is that there not just Floren who have this concern. Many OTHER people like me have this concern... and we're paying customers who wish to know what going on. We're not just paying for it out of the blue. Prorably many people (including myself) have stopped renewing due to no updates as yet, and it means less money to XenForo... less money to support those lawsuits, developers and software.

So why don't atleatest attempt to provide an announcement so people don't need to stop renewing, thinking of change, or posting up those threads? Yes I know that they have a hard time. Instead of saying my 2nd point, I quote mrGTB:

I find it odd how Kier can spend two days converting his own forum, even mentioning babysitting a database conversion over-night, Yet, can't spend 20-30 minutes while bored watching that happen writing a new update announcement here.

I appologize if my language is a bit off, I am not a native English speaker.

 

[LPH]

May I be so bold as to interrupt this discussion and make a suggestion similar to one made earlier - a simple post to update all visitors as to the development but the difference in my suggestion is that the title of the post should simply be Development Update and it is placed as a sticky. Specifically, the development post should be a sticky so it is at the top of the announcement forum. The developers can simply keep a changelog in the single post and edit at their own pleasure.

--------

This post reflects the latest information publicly available. Features may change as development progresses. Future releases are dependent upon many factors. We appreciate your business.

Version 1.2 - alpha - date
Not publicly available
No public release date announced

Version 1.1 released - date
xxxxxx information

Version 1.0 released - date
xxxxxx information

Previous versions .... etc ...
--------

Post is closed to comments and replies. It is edited and updated as time permits.

And that folks is my 2 cents. I look forward to the resolution so that everyone is satisfied.

 

[Sadik B]

They state:

XenForo Limited is a limited company registered in England and Wales with company number 07294282 and registered office at 24 Oak Tree Rd, Tilehurst, RG31 6JX.​

​

Give them a call? I mean, it's a business question right? If you do not get a response (to your satisfaction) you can always adapt to the market and focus on another product. You care bout your money, and they should care about theirs. You're not responsible for the way they handle their business.

Very good point... If I had several thousands of income stalled due to this, I would consider calling them. If they pick, surely they will have to tell you something!