The future of forums (vs social media)

whitetigergrowl said:
It's obvious you have no clue how to use FB, Reddit, or other social media. You're that person that is in denial and still thinks Betamax will win over VCR or HD-DVD will win over Blu-Ray.

I've responded in your quote in bold.
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It's obvious that I think that FB/Twitter are for .. for those that tend to be technically incompetent. It's targeted at the simple minded that don't have to use their brains for much more than it takes to breathe. :p

Sorry that you think it's the best thing since sliced bread - and it may have been at one time.... What folks can't seem to realize - FB/Twitter has ONE platform to integrate the app into... Forums have varieties of "features" and any app is going to miss a bunch of them.. Luckily I don't really care to pursue that group.

And who gives a flying green poop about a "like".... studies have already shown that FB "likes" are useless as a parameter for actual interest - the same as FB followers. It's easy enough to go out and HIRE a "fluffer" to pump up those stats.

As for my sites.. those are for my fun to use.. I don't pursue users as I honestly don't care about users coming to the site. I like the admin (config/templating) aspect of the server and the forums... so I guess that's why I don't really care about drawing in the typical facebook crowd that can barely think, much less post.
That's how come I have a sites on IPS 4.x series, myBB, Burning Board and XenForo.
 
Tracy Perry said:
It's obvious that I think that FB/Twitter are for .. for those that tend to be technically incompetent. It's targeted at the simple minded that don't have to use their brains for much more than it takes to breathe. :p

Sorry that you think it's the best thing since sliced bread - and it may have been at one time.... What folks can't seem to realize - FB/Twitter has ONE platform to integrate the app into... Forums have varieties of "features" and any app is going to miss a bunch of them.. Luckily I don't really care to pursue that group.

And who gives a flying green poop about a "like".... studies have already shown that FB "likes" are useless as a parameter for actual interest - the same as FB followers. It's easy enough to go out and HIRE a "fluffer" to pump up those stats.

As for my sites.. those are for my fun to use.. I don't pursue users as I honestly don't care about users coming to the site. I like the admin (config/templating) aspect of the server and the forums... so I guess that's why I don't really care about drawing in the typical facebook crowd that can barely think, much less post.
That's how come I have a sites on IPS 4.x series, myBB, Burning Board and XenForo.
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The fact there are FB groups with thousands of active members while your forums are very low in numbers and activity speaks volumes about who is right. I've personally seen large forums I visit gradually losing activity and members, let alone having trouble gaining new ones. The field is very congested. And the various forms of social media are absolutely gouging into forums.

Forums may have varieties and features. But the question is, while for you and me those features and stuff might be the best thing since sliced bread, how many members fully use them, let alone use a fraction of them? Very few. Most people like simplicity. And that is why they don't go out of their way to pimp out their user profile, signature, or even avatar. They simply want to get in and get out. Not mess around creating some sort of Myspace type profile.

You're so busy looking at the technical side of things you have completely missed the boat on the user side. Come back when your forums have hundreds or even thousands of active members and thousands of posts and threads. Until then, you're only trying to convince yourself.

Your attitude is actually very poor. You talk about not caring if you draw in the typical Facebook crowd that can barely think and are simple minded. Yet you ignorantly fail to realize or understand who many of your very members likely will be and are. You're dissing not only your members but also potential members because of a social platform they may also prefer to use and you ignorantly see no value in. So you already have pre-conceived ideals and notions on things. And have already set up your forums for failure.

So while you're busy 'playing' admin/owner....others are actually doing it and are having a better understanding of what is actually going on.

Also, since I missed it when I first started typing, there are mods and ways of 'fluffing' up forum stats and activity. Many forum owners (not all), do or have done it at one time or another to help give the artificial believe of forum growth and activity. So how is that any different or better? It's not. So stop trying to pretend just because someone runs a forum rather than a Facebook or Reddit group that they are on some moral high ground and have some fictional higher intelligence. You're only fooling yourself if you honestly believe it.

So while you continue to live in denial and a pseudo-admin world that is there primarily for yourself to amuse yourself with...everyone else is seeing and realizing the real effects you so blindly and ignorantly wish to ignore of social media.
 
I approached a very active Facebook group with 20k members. These people were posting non-stop ALL DAY.

I asked the admin if he wanted me to build a forum for him so he could monetize the 20k members he somehow gathered. He had NO interested or plans for it.

Even offered to cover the costs and manage it for him while he managed the Facebook side of it. Nope. Wasted opportunity there...he would've had something really good with all those very interested members. Just couldn't believe the guy had that big of an active crowd and no interest in taking it to the next level, especially when it cost nothing to him. He could be making some nice money now, but instead just likes to run his free group and get nothing out of it.

....so I bought the domains for his Facebook group name anyway...now if he ever changes his mind, it'll cost him big time or I'll have part ownership!!
 
drastic said:
I approached a very active Facebook group with 20k members. These people were posting non-stop ALL DAY.

I asked the admin if he wanted me to build a forum for him so he could monetize the 20k members he somehow gathered. He had NO interested or plans for it.

Even offered to cover the costs and manage it for him while he managed the Facebook side of it. Nope. Wasted opportunity there...he would've had something really good with all those very interested members. Just couldn't believe the guy had that big of an active crowd and no interest in taking it to the next level, especially when it cost nothing to him. He could be making some nice money now, but instead just likes to run his free group and get nothing out of it.

....so I bought the domains for his Facebook group name anyway...now if he ever changes his mind, it'll cost him big time or I'll have part ownership!!
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You will have to hold that domain for many years until a great forum UI comes with deep FB, Twitter integration.
 
I can't get people to stay on the site and read around enough. Maybe it's my content, but maybe it's the design of a forum that needs an upgrade?

One of these is WordPress. One is XF. Both had same exact content. One had much better stats on the site.Screen Shot 2016-04-25 at 9.10.53 AM.webp Screen Shot 2016-04-25 at 9.11.33 AM.webp
 
Basic functionality... I can take my phone and post straight to FB. It's simple and done. This week I had two Scuba shows I attended and wanted to point, click and post. Forgetaboutit! I would be spending far more time effin around with the phone to post a few pics and would miss talking to potential advertisers. The pictures will wait, and that's the problem for me with forum software right now. PS, if there's a great add on for that, please let me know. I NEED THAT FUNCTIONALITY!
 
Brogan said:
Social networks are content agnostic and in the case of Facebook for example, closely linked with friends and family.
Yes there are pages and groups which are related to a specific subject, but they are incidental and supplementary to the main purpose of the site.

Forums for the most part are focussed on a specific subject, and the forum you are a member of may not be one that your friends or family are interested in.
Indeed, it's highly likely that all of your friends and family have their own favourite subjects and therefore forums (if they participate in them).

They serve very different audiences and purposes.

For general chit chat amongst friends, posting memes, stupid jokes, throwaway comments, etc., Facebook et al are great.

For discussing a specific subject in depth, having rich content, tabulated data, custom developed apps and functions, etc. and being able to refer back to a post you made a year ago, or even a month ago, and kick-starting the discussion again, forums have Facebook beat every time.
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@Brogan I understand what you are saying but the problem goes into the reality that because Facebook is so pervasive in society today, the idea of forums are getting lost. As Facebook adds more power to groups, etc. they are further pushing the envelope into the realm of forums while forums are just that, forums.

Here is an example of what I mean. This political season in the US has been monumental in getting folks motivated to participate. A friend of mine was working on a group trying to get Jim Webb to re-enter the race as an independent. There were four or five Facebook pages that were shooting for this as well as the official campaign page and then later, fifty more pages, one for each State.

I proposed a forum along with Resource manager, etc. to make holding and finding discussions much easier. We promoted the use of Facebook logins and the idea that everything could be shared from the forum to the Facebook pages. The few folks that I was able to get active were loving the ease with which information could be found and shared. BUT and here is the kicker, many folks were too lazy to open yet another browser window and step outside of their Facebook comfort zone or were completely dumbfounded on how a forum works.

Now the ones that are too lazy are lost souls I feel as they would be too lazy to step outside of Facebook even if forums were more like social media sites. Where this discussion would be helpful though is for people who are willing to step outside, to be able to use the software in a manner similar to what they have grown up with, social media.

My two cents in this discussion.
 
sami simo said:
Are those Stats for the same period?
I see one for a day and another for a year.
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Nah. It was old stats using forum software vs new stats using non forum software. The new stats have been pretty consistent for the last few weeks. We now have a much smaller bounce rate and about 5 page views per user. It's just easier to navigate for new users. Forum design, by default, isn't very friendly to the first time user. They just get confused and leave.
 
I have read your comment.. visited another page, and decided I want to reply.
But.. I couldn't find this discussion in the New Posts page, It seems The system assume I have read it and there is no need to show it again, So I have decided to log out just to find this discussion ,then login again to comment..
I could search for it in my last content, but it's the same story, both methods need 3 clicks to access this discussion again.
I think people coming from Facebook will find this uncomfortable... users must remember in which forum the discussion was posted, if they can't, they are lost.
The forum search is also confusing... Why are we asking visitors to introduce the username and specify a date to search information?
How many users or visitors know the thread starter username or the date of posts ?
Maybe the date and username fields are not required, but most people will just give up searching if they think we are asking for details they can't provide.
 
The argument is valid in the scenario I have described Brogan.
Here is a screenshot of the new post page, and as you can see, this thread doesnt show when the last post is read:
Capture.webp
 
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That is new posts which by definition are unread, not recent posts which includes read and unread.
 
I took a screen shot , I didnt design it.
I wonder how a visitor can guess the link of recent posts page is in the new post page. ( Since they are different things as you said)
EDIT: its really the first time I click this link since I use Xenforo.
 
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I could make similar arguments about Facebook, which has dreadful UX/UI and discoverability issues
 
I agree.
I hate Facebook skin and colors, and admit it's difficult to edit multiple basic user setting there.
But it's super easy to post and access new posts.
Xenforo has the best Forum interface, the default theme is a work of art. ( I don't know if its mike work or not?) but it's the most beautiful forum theme ever made in my opinion.
Criticizing the design doesn't mean in any way it's bad. its just our hope to make it better.
 
@sami simo, I agree. We deleted the "New" link and renamed "Recent" to be "New".

Google is not only the forum's best friend: it's our only salvation. Facebook's content just can't be found via Google. For the average Scuba enthusiast, the forum with the best Google connection is the one that will succeed. So far that's me.
 
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