What Do You Want Out Of This Product?

Erik

Well-known member
The downside to not adding "groups" is it is already a feature of the competition....
This doesn't matter to me. They should focus on adding features because they are well-thought-out and good for the product, not because they are in the competition.

Just because X forum software has feature Y, doesn't mean that it is a good feature or that XenForo should add it. :)
 

Brandon_R

Guest
The downside to not adding "groups" is it is already a feature of the competition....
I really hate to post so many anti-agree posts in a row but it really doesn't make sense to take "failed features" from other software and implement it here. If they can find a better way to build this mousetrap i will be the first one to beat a path to their door.
 

Cezz

Well-known member
I want it to install in 3seonds flat... and make me £22,000 a month in advertising and affiliate income...

Ok on a most serious side, I am loving what we have already and I really don't want to ask for much more. First I want to see this brought out, then I can see what can be built well with a mod or a style change. whatever can't be done via a simple mod or skinchange I will then suggest.
 

Cory Booth

Well-known member
I really hate to post so many anti-agree posts in a row but it really doesn't make sense to take "failed features" from other software and implement it here. If they can find a better way to build this mousetrap i will be the first one to beat a path to their door.
Agreed from my perspective... Just pointing out how "others" may feel if it wasn't in the core is all....
Some without any prior experience with either platform may judge others on the features.
I can already see a comparrison box on some site saying:

Included xF XX
Forum_____X X
Groups______X

etc...
But no, I have no use for groups at all....
 

Danny.VBT

Active member
A reliable forum software that promotes an active modding community. And free coffee. But I'll settle for just the former.
 

Crazyfruitbat

Well-known member
groups can be made interesting if they are made in a certain way. The competitions's versions are buried under so much 'stuff', users aren't going to find it - all it takes is for one user to make a group only to see it fail gives a warning to everyone else who was thinking of doing the same thing.

I liked JomSocials's way of dealing with groups, once a group had been made it would go into an activity stream like facebook and so you can see who is joining etc - it makes it very easy to use and other people will join if it is only one click of a button
 

erich37

Well-known member
groups can be made interesting if they are made in a certain way. The competitions's versions are buried under so much 'stuff', users aren't going to find it - all it takes is for one user to make a group only to see it fail gives a warning to everyone else who was thinking of doing the same thing.

I liked JomSocials's way of dealing with groups, once a group had been made it would go into an activity stream like facebook and so you can see who is joining etc - it makes it very easy to use and other people will join if it is only one click of a button
well, this is how VB is having it, right ?

Xing.com is using Groups + Forums in the best and most simple way.....
 

Crazyfruitbat

Well-known member
Really? but that would require an activity stream - where would they put it? it can't go on the front page because of the CMS and it would look odd in the forums...don't tell me... another tab! and multiple template edits! :(
 

Kim

Well-known member
what I would truly love is to have a system where when it gets updated my styles don't break. I know this sounds like a really simple thing, but over on VB4 I have dumped my custom style in favor of a generic one because I know that with every update it becomes more of a pain to fix. Simple styles is something I would love. Though I would be happy having this style to be honest, I think it works well!
This to me is the MOST crucial thing... as a professional skinner I have spent wasted the last 1 and a half years rebuilding the same designs over and over and over and over as IPB endless update and change the underlying code.. my Custom Skin clients have spent many hundreds of dollars each time having their skins rebuilt.. many of them have given up... it is just so very tiresome for all involved.

I love IPB, and have been one of their biggest fans, but the endless upgrades that take out all skins and mods is really depressing and disheartening.

Please xenforo, consider this when designing the skinning/styling engine, and planning upgrade paths, please don't endlessly update code that requires the themes to be rebuilt.

I adore what you have here so far, it is so very fresh and modern and simple and sleek, my wish would be it continues to be so, and that upgrades are not the nightmare they have been with other softwares.

:)
 

Erik

Well-known member
This to me is the MOST crucial thing... as a professional skinner I have spent wasted the last 1 and a half years rebuilding the same designs over and over and over and over as IPB endless update and change the underlying code.. my Custom Skin clients have spent many hundreds of dollars each time having their skins rebuilt.. many of them have given up... it is just so very tiresome for all involved.

I love IPB, and have been one of their biggest fans, but the endless upgrades that take out all skins and mods is really depressing and disheartening.

Please xenforo, consider this when designing the skinning/styling engine, and planning upgrade paths, please don't endlessly update code that requires the themes to be rebuilt.

I adore what you have here so far, it is so very fresh and modern and simple and sleek, my wish would be it continues to be so, and that upgrades are not the nightmare they have been with other softwares.

:)
While they should do all they can to minimize this, you have to realize that in order for the product to move forward, some template and CSS changes are required. The best thing they can do is try to minimize those changes and write a very good template/change merging system to deal with the ones that are necessary. :)
 

Kim

Well-known member
I understand that some changes are of course going to be necessary, however I am sure I am not alone in asking that those be kept to a minimum and be well documented and most importantly well spaced out, allowing Board Admins and designers alike plenty of time between the major drama of an upgrade.

In my experience merge or update systems do not work on modified templates or CSS, they still require a manual upgrade per skin, per template or CSS, with IPB and all the official add on components being now almost 700 Templates and over a dozen CSS sheets it can get very wearing indeed to have to manually update a heavily modified board or Custom Skin(s).
 

Brandon_R

Guest
I understand that some changes are of course going to be necessary, however I am sure I am not alone in asking that those be kept to a minimum and be well documented and most importantly well spaced out, allowing Board Admins and designers alike plenty of time between the major drama of an upgrade.

In my experience merge or update systems do not work on modified templates or CSS, they still require a manual upgrade per skin, per template or CSS, with IPB and all the official add on components being now almost 700 Templates and over a dozen CSS sheets it can get very wearing indeed to have to manually update a heavily modified board or Custom Skin(s).
I have to agree there, these so called merge or update systems are solutions for the wrong problems.
 

Erik

Well-known member
I have to agree there, these so called merge or update systems are solutions for the wrong problems.
Disagree. A properly written merge/update feature can show the user specifically what has changed, offer to merge files if the changes are small/inconsequential, or give the user developer-provided guidance on what needs to be changed. Granted, this may not be helpful/apply to all situations but it would be useful and helpful for many/most board owners and theme designers.

For example, with each template/CSS change the developers could attach a small comment explaining the change, what it's for, what needs to be done if you have a custom theme, etc. IMO it would be very helpful to be able to view the old and new files side-by-side, annotated with developer commentary about each change, etc. Systems that actually merge the files may not be helpful in most cases, but it would be really nice if there was a "merge" system that made updating things as easy as possible (like what I've described above). :)
 

jonsidneyb

Well-known member
I understand that some changes are of course going to be necessary, however I am sure I am not alone in asking that those be kept to a minimum and be well documented and most importantly well spaced out, allowing Board Admins and designers alike plenty of time between the major drama of an upgrade.

In my experience merge or update systems do not work on modified templates or CSS, they still require a manual upgrade per skin, per template or CSS, with IPB and all the official add on components being now almost 700 Templates and over a dozen CSS sheets it can get very wearing indeed to have to manually update a heavily modified board or Custom Skin(s).
You have nice skins. I thought IPB was supposed to be easy to work with? I almost bought it with content and nexus. I held off because of xenForo. I am anxious to see what you come up with for it. Your work looks really nice.
 

Kim

Well-known member
Hi there jonsidneyb, Thanks for your kind words about my skins :)

IPB is pretty easy to work with, it has a fantastic skinning engine, and apart from one or two beefs I love it... the big problem is the upgrades.. 2.3 was very stable and was around for a long time whilst they totally rewrote the software - last year IPS rewrote the Blogs and Gallery, requiring all my pre-made skins to be rebuilt for those changes, then a few months later they moved from 2.3 - 3.0 I had 31 skins for 2.3 and so began the long hard process of manually rebuilding them into 3.0 - I think I got 12 done in between Custom and other work - then 3.1 hit, requiring another Total rebuild, in less than 18 months I have had 3 total rebuilds of skins...As has all my customers. I am only up to 8 or 9 of that original 31 skins, and I am desperate to do something new and different, nothing kills creativity more than having to do the same thing over and over and over.

The point wasn't really anything bad about IPB, at all, don't get me wrong I love 3.1 and applaude IPS for that version, I just hate the pain it has caused.

I was simply asking the Dev's of xenforo to have consideration that people do not like having to re-do everything 3 times in 18 months. Resource sites hate it, Modders hate it, Skinners hate it, and so do Admins.. it is a major inconvenience and can be very costly if you have a Custom Skin and have to pay up hundreds or thousands every time to have your Custom skin or modifications rebuilt.

BTW, this is nothing I have not already said at IPS forums ;)
 

Brandon_R

Guest
Disagree. A properly written merge/update feature can show the user specifically what has changed, offer to merge files if the changes are small/inconsequential, or give the user developer-provided guidance on what needs to be changed. Granted, this may not be helpful/apply to all situations but it would be useful and helpful for many/most board owners and theme designers.

For example, with each template/CSS change the developers could attach a small comment explaining the change, what it's for, what needs to be done if you have a custom theme, etc. IMO it would be very helpful to be able to view the old and new files side-by-side, annotated with developer commentary about each change, etc. Systems that actually merge the files may not be helpful in most cases, but it would be really nice if there was a "merge" system that made updating things as easy as possible (like what I've described above). :)
Agreed, the changes should we very well documented. I idea of "automatic" template upgrades/reverts/merge without any human touch is far off though but i wouldn't say impossible. The side by side comparison should be another neat feature :)
 

jonsidneyb

Well-known member
Hi there jonsidneyb, Thanks for your kind words about my skins :)

IPB is pretty easy to work with, it has a fantastic skinning engine, and apart from one or two beefs I love it... the big problem is the upgrades.. 2.3 was very stable and was around for a long time whilst they totally rewrote the software - last year IPS rewrote the Blogs and Gallery, requiring all my pre-made skins to be rebuilt for those changes, then a few months later they moved from 2.3 - 3.0 I had 31 skins for 2.3 and so began the long hard process of manually rebuilding them into 3.0 - I think I got 12 done in between Custom and other work - then 3.1 hit, requiring another Total rebuild, in less than 18 months I have had 3 total rebuilds of skins...As has all my customers. I am only up to 8 or 9 of that original 31 skins, and I am desperate to do something new and different, nothing kills creativity more than having to do the same thing over and over and over.

The point wasn't really anything bad about IPB, at all, don't get me wrong I love 3.1 and applaude IPS for that version, I just hate the pain it has caused.

I was simply asking the Dev's of xenforo to have consideration that people do not like having to re-do everything 3 times in 18 months. Resource sites hate it, Modders hate it, Skinners hate it, and so do Admins.. it is a major inconvenience and can be very costly if you have a Custom Skin and have to pay up hundreds or thousands every time to have your Custom skin or modifications rebuilt.

BTW, this is nothing I have not already said at IPS forums ;)
I feel like asking you some skin questions but not sure if it is appropriate to ask it out here. One of your skins really caught my attention and would be great with a little modification.
 

Kim

Well-known member
You can always PM me if you like, or join up at my site and ask there if you are more comfortable :)
 

dieketzer

Well-known member
id like there to be more features made available as supported, free, official mods.
i wouldnt mind so many things being left out of the core product, such as social groups, profile styling, dislike, etc if they were supported as xf modules or whatnot. maybe tht may be the best overall approach to features full stop.

but i do not like the idea of spending $ on a base, low feature, lightweight forum system.
and i dont like the idea of too many things requiring use of third-party mods.
 

dutchbb

Well-known member
A few things I can think of, in order of importance, 1 being the most important:

1) a honest and passionate team working on a product with love, and being only happy with the best quality they can possibly deliver
2) support and developers that listen to both the needs and complaints of customers, but are also able to form their own well-reasoned opinion on things
3) stability and security
4) certain basic features build in that are essential for me (infraction system, paid memberships...)
5) an importer that can cover most data and works in a clean and easy way
6) a strong add-on community (need add-ons like 'easy forms' and some other plugins)
7) a better front-end UI than what we currently have in vB3.8
8) a very clear & easy to use ACP
9) an up-to-date code & design
10) an easy to use style & template system
 
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