Waiting on answers before buying?

Robbo

Well-known member
#41
People complain about no answers.
They are given.
People complain about no answers.

Ummm?

Do people not understand what rumour means? I run a business with XenForo add-ons and the lack of development isn't hurting it. The people starting the rumours and the people believing them are. I honestly would be close to folding due to this if I didn't do a crowd fund for the gallery. I mean I read some of the rumours and they made me laugh but people believe them? ****. Get a grip people!
 

Jeremy P

Well-known member
#42
I am a bit put off by your post, so I guess this will be my last one here. I am not some unreasonable conspiracy theorist (and I know there's been a lot of that going around), I am a customer.

Humor me here, I truly beg you.

In the absence of disproof. The rumor mill is unstoppable.
It would have been more appropriate and correct for you to say that the absence of disproof is no better or worse than the presence of proof.

Referring to it as a 'rumor mill' is just as biased a statement in favor of XenForo, as all the rumors are biased against it. What you are saying is no more (or less) believable than all the rumors, the way I see it. Sure, others could feel differently but that is how I look at it.

So KAM hasn't said that personal issues are not affecting the business, therefore you are concerned about that possibility. It's a slightly strange way to reach an obvious conclusion I think. Not just obvious, but clearly stated in the last announcement.
I apologize, you are correct. Speaking of obvious conclusions, you may very well have gathered that I had not re-read the announcement before making the incorrect claim that they had not admitted to it. It was not fresh in my mind and I hope you can find it in you to forgive me for that.

However, you continue to miss the point. You focused on one thing I said that was wrong and ignored the rest. We are all well aware that personal issues have taken a toll on the business, yes. It is no secret, you're right.

I was just hesitant to say so because I was afraid you'd dismiss me as just another crazy. Guess that backfired.

Since I do not wish to feed from the rumor mill, I suppose I do have a question I'd like answered. How long did the personal issues begin affecting the business before they were announced to customers? Until that is answered I don't feel assured that XenForo has been completely transparent and honest. And I know it won't be answered to my satisfaction. But that's okay I can forgive you for that.

I am curious about the actual implications that will have on the business pending the successful outcome of the lawsuit. Not whether or not the issues exist. I know they exist. I want to know what is going to be different about the business on January 16th, 2013 than it was on July 28th, 2010, assuming the lawsuit is defeated.
 

Jeremy P

Well-known member
#44
Nothing will be different on the 16th of Jan. The case will more than likely still being going on.
Similar to with Jake, you are more concerned about the date I posted than what I was really asking about. I even stated that my question was based on the assumption that the lawsuit was defeated the day prior. An answer I'd be satisfied with would be based on that assumption being true, whether or not it will be at that time.

Thanks anyways.
 

Jake Bunce

XenForo moderator
Staff member
#45
How long did the personal issues begin affecting the business before they were announced to customers?
Ashley did ask for understanding about sensitive personal issues. That means he won't go into details. Sorry.

I want to know what is going to be different about the business on January 16th, 2013 than it was on July 28th, 2010, assuming the lawsuit is defeated.
Hypothetical questions like this don't yield useful answers, especially when dealing with a large outcome space like the lawsuit. Assuming there is not a delay, and assuming XenForo wins, and assuming they are awarded legal costs, and assuming IB doesn't appeal, and assuming the duplicate case in the UK is dismissed THEN...
 

Jeremy P

Well-known member
#46
Ashley did ask for understanding about sensitive personal issues. That means he won't go into details. Sorry.
That's fair, I am not demanding answers I am simply stating these are things I am concerned about. I can sleep at night without knowing, but that does not mean my concern is gone. And it certainly doesn't mean they are not valid.

Hypothetical questions like this don't yield useful answers, especially when dealing with a large outcome space like the lawsuit. Assuming there is not a delay, and assuming XenForo wins, and assuming they are awarded legal costs, and assuming IB doesn't appeal, and assuming the duplicate case in the UK is dismissed THEN...
The question was asked in search of answers for what you already claim will not be answered. So it's moot now, isn't it? I suppose a way to ask the same question in a less hypothetical manner might be, "What changes have transpired in the company that will affect the business and product, aside from the lawsuit, in the past 2 years?" but again XenForo has chosen not to elaborate on that.

What I am most put off by though, is I said something along the lines of "they are keeping something from us, sure, but it doesn't deter me from using XF" and you cut that down to "I believe they are keeping something from us, sure" and asked me to elaborate on that, and then turned it against me. I started off with a statement in support of XenForo, and in return you alienated me as a customer. Job well done I guess.
 

David_

Active member
#47
Similar to with Jake, you are more concerned about the date I posted than what I was really asking about. I even stated that my question was based on the assumption that the lawsuit was defeated the day prior. An answer I'd be satisfied with would be based on that assumption being true, whether or not it will be at that time.

Thanks anyways.
Hey man, I'm on your side in these questions, but trust me no matter what is posted here or else where it won't get any of those guys out of hiding and to tend to their responsibilities here. It's clear this place has taken a back seat in their lives (and that's fine and dandy, but it'd be nice to know whats going on), and the only 2 questions that really matter are: Are they ever going to come back? If they do why would anyone still support them, assuming people are left here.

Either way best of luck in your search for answers here.
 

John

Well-known member
#48
...Are they ever going to come back?
I think it's fairly safe to assume that they, themselves, probably can't answer that right now otherwise they would. How that impacts us individually, really, is each individual's decision to make. As for me, I am continuing to run my business as always while at the same time exploring alternatives should the situation change in such a way that I have no other choice but to move on.
 

Vicros

Active member
#49
Sorry once again guys, but after many of posts regarding this issue, im going to go ahead and say it. I will say what the Owners should say...

Stop asking for news or answers, your questions are being ignored. If you can see the owners do not come here.. AT ALL! They do not care at this point. If they did they would be here trying to do just a little bit of damage control on this whole situation. Im sure they do care about their product and customer base, but with all that is going on, XF and the community has taken a back seat for them to tend to their personal lives, and yes i can understand that to a degree. My life myself is very hectic and busy, i work 48 hours a week, i go to school for 40 hours a week, thats 88 hours a freakin weak that im busy but i still find the time to take care of what i need to. Surely KAM can come here and at least say, hey guys were still around, and watching over the community, but we do not have any news or updates on the future of XF at this point, we hope to know more soon.

See look..how hard would that be to say? Now i will wait for Jake to come tell me the same thing i have seen him say a million times, thats what i stopped asking for answers regarding this situation its clear were not getting any, so why freakin ask? Lets just continue to look forward and wait for the first trial date, which by the way guys do not think we will know something on January 15 or 16 because this lawsuit will not be over that soon, and you are naive to think so. I am no troll, im not here starting drama or being rude or negative just speaking openly about this and being blunt with the facts, I have been asked privately about my knowledge on this situation but i will not and do not say, simply because...id like to not get banned hahaha. Ill just come here and piss and moan like the rest and wait for KAM to finally decide they wanna tell us all something...lol that last sentence was a joke, dont go ban happy on me mods.
 

David_

Active member
#50
Sorry once again guys, but after many of posts regarding this issue, im going to go ahead and say it. I will say what the Owners should say...

Stop asking for news or answers, your questions are being ignored. If you can see the owners do not come here.. AT ALL! They do not care at this point. If they did they would be here trying to do just a little bit of damage control on this whole situation. Im sure they do care about their product and customer base, but with all that is going on, XF and the community has taken a back seat for them to tend to their personal lives, and yes i can understand that to a degree. My life myself is very hectic and busy, i work 48 hours a week, i go to school for 40 hours a week, thats 84 hours a freakin weak that im busy but i still find the time to take care of what i need to. Surely KAM can come here and at least say, hey guys were still around, and watching over the community, but we do not have any news or updates on the future of XF at this point, we hope to know more soon.

See look..how hard would that be to say? Now i will wait for Jake to come tell me the same thing i have seen him say a million times, thats what i stopped asking for answers regarding this situation its clear were not getting any, so why freakin ask? Lets just continue to look forward and wait for the first trial date, which by the way guys do not think we will know something on January 15 or 16 because this lawsuit will not be over that soon, and you are naive to think so. I am no troll, im not here starting drama or being rude or negative just speaking openly about this and being blunt with the facts, I have been asked privately about my knowledge on this situation but i will not and do not say, simply because...id like to not get banned hahaha. Ill just come here and piss and moan like the rest and wait for KAM to finally decide they wanna tell us all something...lol that last sentence was a joke, dont go ban happy on me mods.
You might want to stay in school and pick up some extra math classes :D
 

Vicros

Active member
#52
You might want to stay in school and pick up some extra math classes :D
lol meant 88..was looking at the 4 when i typed it. BTW im in school for Mobile Development, not a math teacher haha..maybe when i graduate ill help XF get a decent mobile app/skin since its apparent they aint gonna do it themselves haha
 

Mert

Well-known member
#53
If any more questions will be answered , i will like to know the answer for following question.

Why is xenforo currently being sold to customers where as no development is going on ?

Why didn't KAM choose to hold the sales when unknown issues effected them and they had to step away from development ?

What will happen to current license owners if KAM choose not to return back ?
 

John L.

Well-known member
#54
If any more questions will be answered , i will like to know the answer for following question.

Why is xenforo currently being sold to customers where as no development is going on ?

Why didn't KAM choose to hold the sales when unknown issues effected them and they had to step away from development ?

What will happen to current license owners if KAM choose not to return back ?
I'm not an official XenForo representative and would hardly call myself a fanboy, but perhaps I could answer the first two (since they are essentially the same question). Why not? Is there anything inherently wrong with the product as it stands now (putting development issues aside). Any logical person can make a decision for themselves regarding the software. You can read all of the conversations, conspiracy theories and arguments here on the community forums. So if this is not something someone wants to gamble with then they can move on and choose another product. If they feel XenForo does what they need it to do, then why stop that user from purchasing software they want to use or even develop on top of?
 

jadmperry

Well-known member
#55
If any more questions will be answered , i will like to know the answer for following question.

Why is xenforo currently being sold to customers where as no development is going on ?

Why didn't KAM choose to hold the sales when unknown issues effected them and they had to step away from development ?

What will happen to current license owners if KAM choose not to return back ?
I hold XF to a higher standard than IB. That said, I would compare the two platforms and say that IB has been selling vB 4.x series for years without any development going on (I don't count bug fixes as development). By the same token, it has been years since IB has had any development and I would say they have "stepped away from development" of vB4.x series.

KAM have been away for a few months. IB developers have been absent for years. That's how I see it.
 

Mert

Well-known member
#57
I hold XF to a higher standard than IB. That said, I would compare the two platforms and say that IB has been selling vB 4.x series for years without any development going on (I don't count bug fixes as development). By the same token, it has been years since IB has had any development and I would say they have "stepped away from development" of vB4.x series.

KAM have been away for a few months. IB developers have been absent for years. That's how I see it.
I am not judging anyone my friend , i just want to learn the answers so all possible questions i have will be cleared. I also am not trying to imply anything that states they are doing something wrong.
 

jadmperry

Well-known member
#58
I am not judging anyone my friend , i just want to learn the answers so all possible questions i have will be cleared. I also am not trying to imply anything that states they are doing something wrong.
Mert,

I was not trying to imply any unwarranted judgment on your part. I think it is fair for people to be concerned about the lack of communication here and to want answers to their questions. The answers may not be forthcoming and may be delayed, but I understand the impulse.

I only wanted to point out (and it sounds like you agree) that XF is doing better in producing a product that delivers as promised than IB has been for years (and who have been, since the inception of this company and even before this software was released, using their considerable money resources, trying to destroy it).

EDIT:

As for your question, though while not speaking for the company, I think the reason they are selling this product is because it works better than any other forum (as a standalone, at least) than any of their competitors and delivers as promised for a very reasonable price. Again, that is just my take on it.
 

Chris D

XenForo developer
Staff member
#59
Cynics/conspiracy theorists/**** stirrers (not directed towards anyone in this thread) are all assuming the reason XenForo is still being sold is because the developers know it's Game Over and they're just trying to continue clawing back any losses they've made by continuing to sell the product.

That is one option.

Of course another option is that maybe, just maybe, the developers are only intending this to be a temporary hiatus and therefore it makes perfectly sound business sense for them to continue selling the product.
 
Top