Failed upgrade wave to XF 2.3

[Mr Lucky]

Every Beta and RC announcement contained similar phrasing:

People DO NOT READ DIRECTIONS. Never have, never will.

Indeed but I imagine there could be a huge number of users who don't care to take part in beta testing, hence will not see the beta notice nor the Release announcement now that upgrading is super easy via one click without needing to leave their own ACP. There's nothing really to discourage them...

 

[Arantor]

I guarantee that doesn’t make any difference. The scenario I described earlier with the big notice? There was no ACP upgrade path for that, you had to download and overwrite files. And still people did it without hesitation.

 

[Alan_SP]

We went far away from software coding to psychology.

Well, you can't save them all, but some you can save. It's worth in my opinion.

Trying to justify "we can't save all, so we don't bother at all" is not a good way. I see that developer(s) didn't read part where instructions here on forum differ from instructions in ACP. And that Brogan told that he's trying to improve ACP part.

I personally wait, and I can wait. Some can't. But, some of those that can't wait, they at least would have a better chance to take some precautions. It doesn't matter that many will continue to ignore whatever warnings are in place.

 

[Baby Community]

I read the entire discussion with a smile.


A friend of mine has been impatient and has been working with a broken forum for a long time.

 

[MySiteGuy]

People who don't make frequent backups, don't run test upgrades, and don't back up before the live upgrade with a major point release tend to not learn. For those types, Xenforo could put up flashing warning lights and have air sirens go off warning users, but they still would not listen.

 

[woody]

Perhaps one solution would be to force ALL Add-ons be disabled prior to the upgrade process and include a clear warning to ensure compatibility prior to turning them on one by one...force on a x.x upgrade, recommend on an x.x.x level upgrade. That's always the suggested process per the instructions, but most likely ignored by most admins.

 

[imno007]

I suppose I could live with another obnoxious warning in my admin about how an upgrade might break my addons. A least then we might get fewer threads like this urging XF to do more to save people from themselves.

Honestly, I think most of the people with these kinds of problems knew they were taking a chance. How many of them really didn't know to at least check their addons here to see what XF versions developers showed their addons to be compatible with? Still, I saw plenty of plenty of people having issues with addons even during all the XF betas and then complaining to addon devs that their addons weren't working. Some of that might be down to people just paying zero attention to anything, but I think most of those people simply took a chance on ignoring all that, maybe partly because they got away with it with some previous upgrades. Life on the edge can be risky.

 

[woody]

How many of them really didn't know to at least check their addons here to see what XF versions developers showed their addons to be compatible with?

Place a bet that the vast majority of those with issues have smaller forums and rarely check xenforo.com, and weren't aware of the months of beta/RC releases. They most likely jumped in for their monthly ACP check, saw the 2.3 upgrade option, and pushed the button.

I know I'm on XF multiple times daily and keeping up with many of the issues/discussions, if nothing more than keeping myself informed of issues others are having.

 

[Miri]

On the other hand, that button, so prominently displayed without any warning, makes me curious to press it, but at the same time it raises doubts: for example, does it lead to a page where I could start the update process? Or, if I press that button, does it start automatically and I can't go back..?!

That said, yes, in this case instead of the "update now" button, there should be another button that says "read more," which leads to a new page with the official notice and a link to the guide with the update button to proceed, at least for these important versions.

 

[Taylor J]

Weird seeing people against this suggestion when it won't affect them at all.

 

[AndrewSimm]

I think the display for a second point upgrade should be different than a third point upgrade. Just style it differently and add some warnings.

A forum that sits on the server with another forum I managed had their admin click upgrade and it didn't go well.

 

[Feline Forums]

I've always found it was made abundantly clear that upgrading your forum can break addons and cause trouble!
I don't know what else they can do. For all website owners, it's standard practice to make backups before upgrading software anyways. Am I missing something?

I don't see the harm in adding a small message to the admin panel, I guess. But then people will still complain that it's not clear enough.

 

[Suzanne O]

I've always found it was made abundantly clear that upgrading your forum can break addons and cause trouble!
I don't know what else they can do. For all website owners, it's standard practice to make backups before upgrading software anyways. Am I missing something?

I don't see the harm in adding a small message to the admin panel, I guess. But then people will still complain that it's not clear enough.

When i first went to upgrade my site back all those years ago when they were going from 1.5 to 2.0 it was done by one of the staff here. Think it was Chris who did it.
He told me to always remember if you have any addons to disable them first for any other major upgrades.
He also explained to me that it's better to upgrade when the next version is out.

Some people don't realise that if they don't upgrade that they will get errors by not upgrading.

 

[BikeGremlin]

In my experience, it is usual for software to have bugs.

I do backups, and test even the security-critical patches in a staging environment before doing it in production.

For minor version updates, it makes sense to wait for at least a few months before updating (usually a few weeks after the first patch). For major version updates, it can take about 6 months for a really good patched version.

If many people didn't update right after a release, that process would take longer, as many bugs get missed during development and beta testing (XenForo for one has many different add-on combinations and server configurations for different users, so it is practically impossible to account for all that before a release).

For a comparison - I use WordPress a lot, and WordPress urges people to set their websites to automatically update as soon as an update is released. It is a lot more pushy/annoying when you don't update ASAP, compared to XenForo.

Relja

 

[Mr Lucky]

We are seeing more and issues that are purely due to upgrading to 2.3 without checking for compatibility of addons or without testing them (whether described as compatible or not).

This is obviously due the fact that most minor upgrades really do got through fine with no addon issues and people just think, "oh another upgrade let's just go for it as usual"

I think this problem has probably escalated since the ability to upgrade from the admin panel instead of having to go through the process of download, unzip upload.

This just shows that it would be great to have a very different and in your face notice when (as in this case) there really is going be an issue for many addons.

 

[Miri]

We are seeing more and issues that are purely due to upgrading to 2.3 without checking for compatibility of addons or without testing them (whether described as compatible or not).

This is obviously due the fact that most minor upgrades really do got through fine with no addon issues and people just think, "oh another upgrade let's just go for it as usual"

I think this problem has probably escalated since the ability to upgrade from the admin panel instead of having to go through the process of download, unzip upload.

This just shows that it would be great to have a very different and in your face notice when (as in this case) there really is going be an issue for many addons.

That is to say...

M

Post in thread 'Failed upgrade wave to XF 2.3'

Jul 14, 2024

On the other hand, that button, so prominently displayed without any warning, makes me curious to press it, but at the same time it raises doubts: for example, does it lead to a page where I could start the update process? Or, if I press that button, does it start automatically and I can't go back..?!

That said, yes, in this case instead of the "update now" button, there should be another button that says "read more," which leads to a new page with the official notice and a link to the guide with the update button to proceed, at least for these important versions.

• Miri

• 

 

[BikeGremlin]

We are seeing more and issues that are purely due to upgrading to 2.3 without checking for compatibility of addons or without testing them (whether described as compatible or not).

This is obviously due the fact that most minor upgrades really do got through fine with no addon issues and people just think, "oh another upgrade let's just go for it as usual"

I think this problem has probably escalated since the ability to upgrade from the admin panel instead of having to go through the process of download, unzip upload.

This just shows that it would be great to have a very different and in your face notice when (as in this case) there really is going be an issue for many addons.

That makes sense. Though, it is fair to note the difference and compare with "other popular software":



The WP note seems like it is urgent to update. XenForo is more like: it's out, if you want it (click on the button if yes).

 

[mattrogowski]

Can only really compare to other forum software, WordPress prioritises backwards compatibility so you usually don't need to do anything at all when upgrading to even second point releases.

 

[Deleted member 184953]

That makes sense. Though, it is fair to note the difference and compare with "other popular software":

You are so manipulative!!



Underline what needs to be emphasized!

 

[BikeGremlin]

You are so manipulative!!

View attachment 306408

Underline what needs to be emphasized!

View attachment 306405

That's how you see it (I see it differently).

WP constantly bothers with updates - and they are often messy, especially the major versions like the current 6.6 (they don't follow the semantic versioning template, so 6.6 is a major update).

XenForo shows it as "now available" and offers a button to update now if you want.
WP asks you to update now.
It is a difference, at least in my opinion (you are free to disagree).