Not planned Better SEO for Threads

markoroots

Active member
Hi there, I have noted that the Tags hx on the threads seems not be fully optimized. This create confusion for the search engines to index better the contents.
Here an example.
In this case about a thread token here for test, this one:
Code:
https://xenforo.com/community/threads/upgrade-help.194097/

we can see that the tags h"x" are not well optimized. Tags h1, h2, h3, ecc are needed from search engine to understand the content of a page.
So if we have these sequence for the thread above:

H1
H1: XF 2.2 Upgrade Help

H2
H2: 0

H3
H3: Search
H3: Similar threads

H4
H4: Rusty Snippets
H4: Rusty Snippets
H4: Brogan
H4: Mike
H4: Rusty Snippets
H4: Mike
H4: Rusty Snippets
H4: Rusty Snippets
H4: Rusty Snippets
H4: Rusty Snippets
H4: GW2
H4: Rusty Snippets

H5
H5: Active member
H5: Active member
H5: XenForo moderator
H5: XenForo developer
H5: Active member
H5: XenForo developer
H5: Active member
H5: Active member
H5: Active member
H5: Active member
H5: New member
H5: Active member

H6
H6: 0



it create confusion to the crawlers so also not good for the indexing purposes.

The best configuration for a thread is to show only the more relevant informations related to the content of that thread, not else.
This need 2 things: "Title of the thread" and
"Name of the section/node", that is more importat because is rellay descriptive for the content of the threads.

So the best configuration should be this:

H1
Title of the thread

H2
Name of the node

and nothing else.

Because adding all those other information as h3, h4, h5, h6, not related to the content of the thread, saying to the search engines that are relevant things about that, isn't really good.
 
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djbaxter

Well-known member
From an SEO standpoint, Google doesn't really care about any of that. There is no "best" configuration for Google. Use whatever H tags make sense for your readers.


The relative importance of heading tags, that H1 is more important than H2, used to be a real ranking factor over 15 years ago.

John Mueller explains that is no longer the case:

So… this question of… how should I order my H1, H2, H3, headings and what should the content be, that’s something from my point of view isn’t really that relevant.
Heading tags can indicate hierarchical levels of information, that several H3 headers are sub-topics of the previous H2. That’s not a ranking factor issue. It’s proper organization of a web document.

What Mueller appears to address is that rote SEO idea that one heading is more important than another heading for ranking purposes.
 

Hoffi

Well-known member
Its more important for screen readers than for google.

Google tries always to see a page as a human, and you can not see which H-tag is used.
 

markoroots

Active member
These are relevant tags hx, not those we have in the threads.

Screenshot_2021-05-13 HTML Headings Checker (H1 up to H6) - SEO Review Tools.png

What we have in the threads create only confusion to the crawlers.

H2 not available... also
 

markoroots

Active member
The image doesnt't works to be enlarged. This also should be fixed.

DjBaxter for the url you have posted, this:


Summary​

Input URL: https://www.searchenginejournal.com/heading-tags-for-seo/341817/

has these tags:


H1
H1: Google Explains How to Use Headings for SEO

H2
H2: How to Use Heading Elements?
H2: Background on Heading Tags for SEO
H2: John Mueller Rebuts Old SEO Practice
H2: The Right Way to Use Heading Tags
H2: Heading Tags No Longer Ranking Factors?
H2: Takeaways
H2: Roger Montti
H2: How to Advertise in Newsletters: A Beginner's Guide
H2: Top SEO Secrets From the Leading Organizations
H2: Subscribe to SEJ

H3
H3: Core Web Vitals: A Complete Guide
H3: Subscribe to SEJ
H3: Subscribe to SEJ

H4
H4: An Up-to-Date Guide on Good SEO Content vs. Bad SEO Content
H4: SEO Cost Calculator: How Much Should You Budget for SEO Services?
H4: Your SEO Roadmap Is Wrong: Mapping Digital Success & SEO Through Uncertain Terrain

H5
H5: 0

H6
H6: 0

These is relevant for the crawlers, not our usernames and the rest we have there...
 
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markoroots

Active member
So this is a good idea...
We can add as h3 (h1 and h2 just told what shoud be added) the titles of the threads found in the "Similar Threads" tab inside the page.
That is good for seo.
Tag h4, name of the board.
 
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djbaxter

Well-known member
You are not listening or completely missing the point. You titled this thread "Better SEO for threads". H tags are not a ranking factor, nor will they increase clickthrough rates in search results. H tags make your content prettier and easier to read. They are for your visitors and readers, not for SEO/ranking.
 

markoroots

Active member
In reality the H tags are Only used from the search engines to understand the content of a page, are not useful for the users that doesn't see that tags that are inside the code. If you let understand better the search engines the content of a page is more simple to be well indexed and this will increase the position of your contents, more clicks and so a better ranking of a site that is more clicked instead of a site that has less click and so less traffic.

Google wrote this about it:
  • Title tags and meta description tags are easy ways to improve your site's visibility in Google search results, yet we still see webmasters not fully utilizing their potential. We have a bit of help available about writing good page titles and descriptions which you can read to brush up on the subject. That said, you can ignore the meta keywords, at least as far as Google is concerned.
  • One way Google's algorithms determine the context of content on a page is by looking at the page's headings. The way semantic markup is used throughout a site, including h1, h2, and h3 tags, helps us to understand the priorities of a site's content. One should not fret, though, about every single H tag. Using common sense is the way to go.
  • Just as we recommend you structuring pages logically, it is similarly important to structure the whole website, particularly by linking to related documents within your site as necessary. This helps both users and search engine bots explore all the content you provide.


So if you want use the H tags must be used good with the relevant informations (as the example of the link you send me that I have analyzed and shown you) about the content of a page/thread, not adding usernames of users, search box, or active members that have 0 value to understand the content related to that page.
So or you don't add these informations, or if you add, is important to use the right tags, not words unrelevant to that context/content.
Is simple.
 

djbaxter

Well-known member
One more time: You titled this thread "Better SEO for threads". H tags are not a ranking factor, nor will they increase clickthrough rates in search results. H tags make your content prettier and easier to read. They are for your visitors and readers, not for SEO/ranking.
 

Forsaken

Well-known member
In reality the H tags are Only used from the search engines to understand the content of a page, are not useful for the users that doesn't see that tags that are inside the code. If you let understand better the search engines the content of a page is more simple to be well indexed and this will increase the position of your contents, more clicks and so a better ranking of a site that is more clicked instead of a site that has less click and so less traffic.

Google wrote this about it:
  • Title tags and meta description tags are easy ways to improve your site's visibility in Google search results, yet we still see webmasters not fully utilizing their potential. We have a bit of help available about writing good page titles and descriptions which you can read to brush up on the subject. That said, you can ignore the meta keywords, at least as far as Google is concerned.
  • One way Google's algorithms determine the context of content on a page is by looking at the page's headings. The way semantic markup is used throughout a site, including h1, h2, and h3 tags, helps us to understand the priorities of a site's content. One should not fret, though, about every single H tag. Using common sense is the way to go.
  • Just as we recommend you structuring pages logically, it is similarly important to structure the whole website, particularly by linking to related documents within your site as necessary. This helps both users and search engine bots explore all the content you provide.


So if you want use the H tags must be used good with the relevant informations (as the example of the link you send me that I have analyzed and shown you) about the content of a page/thread, not adding usernames of users, search box, or active members that have 0 value to understand the content related to that page.
So or you don't add these informations, or if you add, is important to use the right tags, not words unrelevant to that context/content.
Is simple.
The way semantic markup is used throughout a site, including h1, h2, and h3 tags, helps us to understand the priorities of a site's content.

That's not SEO, that is just helping them navigate the structure of your site, which Google does not really have an issue of with XenForo.
 

markoroots

Active member
Hi Froksen, in reality I don't know if you have read well my posts. Is not important what we, you and I, thinking about it. The only important thing is what Google says about that.
Him says this:
  • One way Google's algorithms determine the context of content on a page is by looking at the page's headings. The way semantic markup is used throughout a site, including h1, h2, and h3 tags, helps us to understand the priorities of a site's content. One should not fret, though, about every single H tag. Using common sense is the way to go.
  • Just as we recommend you structuring pages logically, it is similarly important to structure the whole website, particularly by linking to related documents within your site as necessary. This helps both users and search engine bots explore all the content you provide.
So if you think that this is not SEO, I think we are really out of road. If also think that the usernames of the users, or the "search box" or the status of the members that partecipate to a thread are good instructions to explain the crawlers what is there inside that thread I cannot do anything more then to say you that is not good.

I have told you what are the Google Guide Lines
I have also shown a professional SEO site how is really well configured
and I have also shown how are configured our threads.

Then we are all free to configure our sites site as we want. ;)
 
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djbaxter

Well-known member
So if you think that this is not SEO, I think we are really out of road. If also think that the usernames of the users, or the "search box" or the status of the members that partecipate to a thread are good instructions to explain the crawlers what is there inside the threads I cannot do anything more then to say you that is not good.
It's not a matter of THINKING it has nothing to do with SEO. It doesn't. And Google has confirmed that several times.

Use lots of H tags. Use no H tags. Use one H1 tag, or three, or none. It just doesn't matter to Google's algorithms. It's completely irrelevant. It won't affect your ranking at all. It doesn't even affect click-through rates.

I don't think you understand the meaning of SEO: Search Engine Optimization.


SEO stands for “search engine optimization.” In simple terms, it means the process of improving your site to increase its visibility for relevant searches. The better visibility your pages have in search results, the more likely you are to garner attention and attract prospective and existing customers to your business.


Search engines such as Google and Bing use bots to crawl pages on the web, going from site to site, collecting information about those pages and putting them in an index. Next, algorithms analyze pages in the index, taking into account hundreds of ranking factors or signals, to determine the order pages should appear in the search results for a given query.

Search ranking factors can be considered proxies for aspects of the user experience. Our Periodic Table of SEO Factors organizes the factors into six main categories and weights each based on its overall importance to SEO. For example, content quality and keyword research are key factors of content optimization, and crawlability and mobile-friendliness are important site architecture factors.

The search algorithms are designed to surface relevant, authoritative pages and provide users with an efficient search experience. Optimizing your site and content with these factors in mind can help your pages rank higher in the search results.

What you are reading and citing are recommendations for content and appeal to human visitors, not recommendations for ranking better.

So go ahead and do whatever you want with H tags on your sites. Just don't delude yourself or anyone else that it's going to rank your site better or get you more traffic.
 

markoroots

Active member
So this site you always reccomand to watch, have lost his time to configure so well the H tags? :D
The H tags in the last times are less relevant for Google that is true, but not H1 and H2 that give the guide lines to the crawlers.
So for this you are free to add those tags or not, that is also true, but not to add unrelevant tags.
Then for your information, are 15 years that I study the SEO.
 
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markoroots

Active member
Djbaxter is not a challenge on who of us is more expert about SEO. It was only a confrontation on something I have found useful to speak about. 😘
 

markoroots

Active member
Bully for you. I have been involved in and studying SEO since the early 1990s. I launched my first forum, not my first website but my first forum, in March 1994. So what?

You don't seem to have learned much in those 15 years...

In reality checking my site on Web.dev it seems that something I have learned

1621021911923.png

but you have reason I still have to continue to study to make better. :)
I still need to fix that 2 points so for this I was checking the last things. :) 😘
 
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Forsaken

Well-known member
Hi Froksen, in reality I don't know if you have read well my posts. Is not important what we, you and I, thinking about it. The only important thing is what Google says about that.
Him says this:
  • One way Google's algorithms determine the context of content on a page is by looking at the page's headings. The way semantic markup is used throughout a site, including h1, h2, and h3 tags, helps us to understand the priorities of a site's content. One should not fret, though, about every single H tag. Using common sense is the way to go.
  • Just as we recommend you structuring pages logically, it is similarly important to structure the whole website, particularly by linking to related documents within your site as necessary. This helps both users and search engine bots explore all the content you provide.
So if you think that this is not SEO, I think we are really out of road. If also think that the usernames of the users, or the "search box" or the status of the members that partecipate to a thread are good instructions to explain the crawlers what is there inside that thread I cannot do anything more then to say you that is not good.

I have told you what are the Google Guide Lines
I have also shown a professional SEO site how is really well configured
and I have also shown how are configured our threads.

Then we are all free to configure our sites site as we want. ;)
Posting the same thing repeatedly when you've clearly misunderstood what you are posting does not change the fact that you've misunderstood it.

Google themselves say semantic markup (header tags) is used for them to understand the priority of the sites structure; it does not increase optimization. It just means the bot has an easier time reading your page.

XenForo's markup is already optimized to the point that Googles bot does not have much issues with discovering or understanding content. The places where header tags may make a difference would be user submitted content, but that is not something that XenForo controls, and it comes down to how you've trained your users. Even then, content itself is more important than the header optimizing that you are trying to ask for.

You continually post one link, that focuses on the semantic nature of good structure markup, but you have ignored every update to how headings are used in SEO in the last 10 years. They are important in so far as they are used properly and that they are used, but they are not in any way used to game the system. Rewriting the way that XenForo uses headings would be a larger under taking than is necessary, and the benefit of which would be negligible to say the least.

In the last image you posted, you would be better working on your performance and best practices than focusing on SEO. Perfect SEO is the pot of gold at the end of the rainbow; you will forever chase it and never get to where you want to go. Focus on the major things, and ignore the minor ones that have no purpose, otherwise you will get diminishing returns on your investment of time.
 

markoroots

Active member
Forsaken the performance of my site is this

1621058037912.png

What you see there in my previous post is related to the thing I have told you before "Google is never happy" so for this many Well-Known users is asking to Xenforo developers to implement the code with the last Guide Lines of Google as you can see here:


But there are more and more other threads about that.
And these are things I hope you should know.
 

djbaxter

Well-known member
Forsaken the performance of my site is this

View attachment 251959

What you see there in my previous post is related to the thing I have told you before "Google is never happy" so for this many Well-Known users is asking to Xenforo developers to implement the code with the last Guide Lines of Google as you can see here:


But there are more and more other threads about that.
And these are things I hope you should know.
Absolutely NONE of that has anything to do with H tags. No link or connection whatsoever.

Which is what people have been telling you since you started this thread.

Tenacity and persistence can be good traits in the right circumstances.

Wilfully ignorant stubbornness is never a positive thing.
 

markoroots

Active member
I didn't say that the performance of the site is related to H tags, but it seems you don't read the posts and talk.
I have also shown you the Google guide lines about H tags, (that you should know if always want make the professor) then you are free to think what you want.
Also is from the beginin of this thread that you are offending me, I let you talk, maybe you don't understand what is a community and how to dialog in it.
 
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