Are you going to ForumCon 2014?

[CallieJo]

Carlos, I admire your passion for this event. You obviously have had/seen/heard some good come from these or you wouldn't have so much passion for them.

Maybe it's the way they present this event that makes it less appealing? But, I personally think that they need to focus more on what the majority of current forum owners expect from Forumcon. Have they asked around forum admin communities to get their input & perk their interest? Maybe they have already...I don't know.

IMHO, a lot of the speakers should be a mix of well-known names that are recognized from forum communities (XF, IPB, VB, PHPbb, MyBB, TAZ, AA, AE, WHT, etc). I only say that because it's an event for forum owners. So it seems logical. Maybe they already do and I just don't recognize real names....

As for me, although I'd be interested out of curiosity, I would never attend unless it was extremely nearby and on a day I could take off from our brick & mortar businesses. I'm on the East Coast. As lovely as CA is, I have no plans on visiting.

I hope this year's event brings many good things to you and all those who do attend.

 

[Brent W]

At some point, I am sure, one of the people Viglink has on staff or hired for this will show up and start discussing issues like they did last year on a few admin forums. Once the event is over, that person will disappear and not be heard from again. This is what happened here: http://www.theadminzone.com/forums/showpost.php?p=701619&postcount=90

The people that put this on and sponsor it do not do so because they enjoy forums. Once the conference is over, they disappear. They rarely participate on forums for forum admins, such as TAZ or http://www.admin-talk.com and are rarely seen else where that might interest forum admin owners unless there is money involved for them.

I'm also not claiming to be unbiased here as I am not a fan of Viglink and the people that are behind it. So take what I say with that in mind. If you live close by and can score a free ticket then I don't suppose it hurts to go. I would never pay to go though, much less fly across the country and spend the premium that it takes to hang out in San Francisco for a few days.

 

[Allen]

Isn't most of the info disseminated at this type of conference already online and available?

Yeah, but ForumCon/Speakers post the content a day later to a week later. So, if you want to learn from the people who've "been there, done that." You'll have to be there to really understand how to make your forum big, more active, and so on.

Not really what I meant. In terms of scope, I believe most (if not all) of the info shared could be found from online sources. Might be more time consuming, but it would be cheaper and (if you don't enjoy being hit on by commercial sales people) much more pleasant.

However, let's go with your premise as stated above. If the "ForumCon/Speakers post the content a day later to a week later", what's the issue? They post the info, as you said, right? Whether it's a day or a week later is not going to really matter, is it? Plus, as I intimated, the info is already online in one form or another, so...

I just don't see your point.

BTW - I have no relationship nor issues with any of the companies involved in running this event.

 

[Rob]

If I lived on its doorstep I would attend but not at those prices. My attendance would mainly be to meet other forum owners and not due to the event content or exhibition. Waste of money imo.

 

[DBA]

Maybe if like... The Sandman, Shawn Hogan (whom already said he wouldn't go), Stuart Wright, and other big-board owners were on-board to travel and speak at the event to cover topics you want... That'd be the path he would be on, but right now not a lot of people know about ForumCon enough to get in and speak.

If you're looking to start or build up a forum getting them to open up would be very beneficial to you. However what exactly do they have to gain by doing this? That'd be like a big car dealer telling a smaller car dealer, across the street, all their marketing and sales strategies. Good luck with that.

This is why these events will have a sponsor feel to them.

 

[Carlos]

Agreed. And to think to actually charge for something like this? Insane.

If you think that's insane... Let's go by the numbers in events. I just want to educate you and everyone else. Ready?

E3 is short for Electronic Entertainment Expo, the world's largest video game and entertainment convention costs $795 ($995 after 4/28/14) today - I'm actually surprised that they jacked up the prices this year for a 3 day pass for normal attendees. It used to cost around $200 just to get in as attendee for the whole show.

Now, GDC is short for Game Developer Conference - a expo that focuses on game developers, game professionals, and investors meeting together - take a wild guess how much it costs. Do it.


Nope.

Nope.

It's $1,475 if you registered back in January, right now it costs $1,975 for all access throughout the whole expo. On-site it costs you a whooping $2,000 just to get into the front door for all access. And that's barely even scratching the surface. Here is the prices and for what, and what it gets you.

Now, why is this, you ask? It's because the actual rental of the conventions/expos costs anywhere in the hundreds of thousands of dollars. In fact, they [the organizing bodies of those conventions/expos] charge each, and every single one of the exhibitors around $1k to $50k just to reserve the spot at the expo/convention. Now, let's take the coin and flip it: Many of the large conventions costs developers/publishers an upward of $150k to $300k just to install the whole booth at the expo/convention.

Depending, of course, how crazy detailed or how big your booth is...

Where I'm getting at? Well, small events like ForumCon is miniscule compared to the large [corporate] events like GDC/E3. Oliver has to pay double the room rental where ForumCon is now currently taking place. The first two years it only costed Oliver a measly $1,000 to rent a small room (1st and 2nd year), the room that they rent now, is twice the room I started in - in the first floor. The basement floor (where ForumCon hosted last year, and will this year) is about 2 times the size of the first floor. I'm guessing he's paying $5,000 to the most $10,000 just for 3 separate rooms. Yes, three. One small one, one big one, and the reception area.

Not really what I meant. In terms of scope, I believe most (if not all) of the info shared could be found from online sources. Might be more time consuming, but it would be cheaper and (if you don't enjoy being hit on by commercial sales people) much more pleasant.

However, let's go with your premise as stated above. If the "ForumCon/Speakers post the content a day later to a week later", what's the issue? They post the info, as you said, right? Whether it's a day or a week later is not going to really matter, is it? Plus, as I intimated, the info is already online in one form or another, so...

Like you said, it is time consuming, but cheaper to post videos, and the slides - instead of recaps of the event. Most ForumCon folks like short articles, I learned. I had a post to share on ForumCon, but Lucy said it was too long, so she and I decided to take one of her favorite parts and post it. So I did. I modified it a bit here and there. Then it was live.

But yeah, the info is available "elsewhere."

I just don't see your point.

I thought you were talking about videos, slides and whatnot. Not this "elsewhere" you were talking about...

If you're looking to start or build up a forum getting them to open up would be very beneficial to you. However what exactly do they have to gain by doing this? That'd be like a big car dealer telling a smaller car dealer, across the street, all their marketing and sales strategies.

A lot of the people who create admin sites are usually people who've been there and done that. They've made a niche site of their own or general-purpose sites.

What do they have to gain from speaking at events even if they are pre-established? Getting their name out there. This applies to just about EVERYONE. Investors, Entrepreneurs, Website owners, Business owners, Professional people in the area of their expertise, and so on and on.

Let's take investors for example. Even if you invested in a company like Twitter and you took it to IPO or "better" (billion dollar club and beyond), you're still a "no-name" until you start speaking at events. If you want to invest into new and up-coming companies, you'll have to take your ego and leave it at the doorstep and be a speaker whether it's a small-name event or a big-name event. You have to get yourself out there.

As an start-up entrepreneur, you'll have to go from your home to an event to get your name on the map. It's hard but you keep at it, and if successful - you not only get positive feedback to your company, you also get capital (ahem, money).

For professionals, it's networking, the smallest lead can lead YOU to a job.

Do you understand what I'm saying now?

 

[whynot]

I just want to educate you and everyone else.

Thanks.

 

[Divvens]

But E3 and other expo's offer more than Forumcon, comparing them makes no sense at all. Because paying for something that is worth it and overpaying for something are two different things, Example: Paying $140 for a XenForo license is very much worth it, but paying $XXX for a certain competitor starting with V and ending with N is overpaying/overpriced/a loss.

Con's are valued for each by what they get out of it, most of the other cons are informative, aren't filled with people trying to shove products down left, right and center and you find people whom you can speak to and go on to maintain a friendly relationship. Forumcon is doing something wrong to have so many people saying "nay" to it, I think if they tried to stop woo-ing corporate's who just want to advertise and rather contacted many known/big forums for suggestions on how to make Forumcon better and added in more for your regular forum admin it'd have much more value for money.

 

[Sheldon]

Even if you invested in a company like Twitter and you took it to IPO or "better" (billion dollar club and beyond), you're still a "no-name" until you start speaking at events. If you want to invest into new and up-coming companies, you'll have to take your ego and leave it at the doorstep and be a speaker whether it's a small-name event or a big-name event. You have to get yourself out there.

Sorry, if my company ever got to $1billion, I wouldn't worry to much about anyone considering me a "no-name" if I didn't speak at an event. Plus, if I am the one that is doing the INVESTING of any money, why do I have to speak? Maybe if you are looking for an investor you can do the speaking, not the way you have proposed.

I fail to see the point you are trying to make with that.

 

[Carlos]

Sorry, if my company ever got to $1billion, I wouldn't worry to much about anyone considering me a "no-name" if I didn't speak at an event. Plus, if I am the one that is doing the INVESTING of any money, why do I have to speak? Maybe if you are looking for an investor you can do the speaking, not the way you have proposed.

I fail to see the point you are trying to make with that.

You fail to see my point because you don't like my tips or ideas. So, you know what? Instead of wasting my time arguing with you - I'll point you to an article where someone I know was interviewed.

Up to that point, Fernandez had invested in real estate and his own businesses, but never into someone else’s venture. After taking angel investing courses at Stanford – while also taking programming classes — that changed in 2010, when he met two students who were creating an online document storage business.

“I saw what they could do with the technology, but they had no business experience. I felt I could help take them to the next level and also provide the $25,000 they needed for their budget,” Fernandez recalls. “That’s when I learned how to coach entrepreneurs and move them forward.”

Subsequently, word spread and Fernandez was called on by other entrepreneurs. In 2012, he became a co-founder of the SF Angel Fund, a $10 million fund that focuses on seed and early stage consumer Internet and software startups. The fund doles out between about $25,000 to $250,000 per investment. Fernandez declines to discuss the number of companies the fund has invested in to date.

Read and think about it. It's not that hard to understand. Investors don't like to be hammered by hundreds of people, so they have this "hard to get" mentality. However, they also want to be known as an expert in their domain expertise.

 

[Sheldon]

I don't see anywhere in that paragraph where he was a speaker anywhere....

 

[Carlos]

I don't see anywhere in that paragraph where he was a speaker anywhere....

Mother. of. God! *Facepalms* I just linked you to the article!

Entrepreneurs hungry for seed funding can submit their business plans to SF Angels’ online platform, Dreamfunded.com. Additionally, Fernandez is a frequent speaker and judge at meetups and events where there are pitch contests, so those attending can approach him with their ideas.

 

[Sheldon]

Apologies Carlos, I assumed you quoted the important parts. I'm not interested in reading the entire article.

You reaction is enough to step out of this thread though. It's impossible to discuss absolutely anything with you.

Enjoy ForumCon.

 

[RickM]

You reaction is enough to step out of this thread though. It's impossible to discuss absolutely anything with you.

I have to agree. Despite the universal conclusion that ForumCon != Good for forum owners, the insistence still seems to only be 'oh but it is' with no real reason as to WHY it's good. WHY we should go and WHY it's worth the money.

As far as I see it, to be brutally honest ForumCon looks like absolute crap, created to line VigLink's pockets. They have no experience, interest or knowledge on running communities, and most of their staff consists of "marketing experts" who are hell bent on getting as much commission as possible.

The poll results say it all. The lack of any real information says it all. The reviews say it all.

94% of the people who voted in this thread said they wouldn't go. What does that tell you? It tells me that whoever is in charge of marketing ForumCon, and the person in charge of arranging what happens at the conference are both doing crap jobs.

 

[rexxxy]

didnt a software compay wen to forumcon and put up only a mockup don't touch display of its latest software

something like this should include
skin workshop
mod workshop
moderating workshop
developers workshop
software companies like IP VB XF demoing whats to comes or even product release

You need some added value other than sitting and hearing people talk about nothing you can benefit from

 

[Carlos]

I have to agree. Despite the universal conclusion that ForumCon != Good for forum owners, the insistence still seems to only be 'oh but it is' with no real reason as to WHY it's good. WHY we should go and WHY it's worth the money.

Why are you agreeing with Sheldon? That comment isn't directed at what you're saying. The conversation is like this:

Sorry, if my company ever got to $1billion, I wouldn't worry to much about anyone considering me a "no-name" if I didn't speak at an event. Plus, if I am the one that is doing the INVESTING of any money, why do I have to speak? Maybe if you are looking for an investor you can do the speaking, not the way you have proposed.

I fail to see the point you are trying to make with that.

You fail to see my point because you don't like my tips or ideas. So, you know what? Instead of wasting my time arguing with you - I'll point you to an article where someone I know was interviewed.

Read and think about it. It's not that hard to understand. Investors don't like to be hammered by hundreds of people, so they have this "hard to get" mentality. However, they also want to be known as an expert in their domain expertise.

And then the mind-boggling comment...

I don't see anywhere in that paragraph where he was a speaker anywhere....

That's why this comment...

Mother. of. God! *Facepalms* I just linked you to the article!

That's what led to this comment (one that you quoted)...

Apologies Carlos, I assumed you quoted the important parts. I'm not interested in reading the entire article.

You reaction is enough to step out of this thread though. It's impossible to discuss absolutely anything with you.

So, why? Really. Sheldon just has a habit of tearing my name in public.

What you're doing, however is putting words into my mouth. Saying that I'm insisting that ForumCon is "worth it" (your wording), I never said it was worth it (not the way you said it or are saying) - I'm just trying to defend the false claims in this thread. I'm saying it's worth it, but I'm not insisting that it is. Big difference.

As far as I see it, to be brutally honest ForumCon looks like absolute crap, created to line VigLink's pockets. They have no experience, interest or knowledge on running communities, and most of their staff consists of "marketing experts" who are hell bent on getting as much commission as possible.

You are entitled to your opinion... however, comments like this one:

It tells me that whoever is in charge of marketing ForumCon, and the person in charge of arranging what happens at the conference are both doing crap jobs.

Is insulting. The marketing person just got hired last year, she did a GREAT job managing the whole event. Granted, there were more staff members doing this and that, but Lucy was the stand-out staffer who put her sweat, her struggles, her passion on the line only to have people like you calling on her crap. She's a lady from another country [British and all].

didnt a software compay wen to forumcon and put up only a mockup don't touch display of its latest software

something like this should include
skin workshop
mod workshop
moderating workshop
developers workshop
software companies like IP VB XF demoing whats to comes or even product release

You need some added value other than sitting and hearing people talk about nothing you can benefit from

1) Video below:

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2) Proboards did demo their product last year:

 

[tajhay]

Judging by carlos's over the top reactions and his inability to discuss/debate sensibly on anything i wouldnt even think about going to ForumCon. If anything, ForumCon should pay you to stop trying to advertise them as you are probably putting off people from going to that.

 

[RobParker]

I'm saying it's worth it, but I'm not insisting that it is. Big difference.

You've now said it repeatedly and forcefully without accepting that others say it isn't worth it. That's the definition of "insist".

 

[Carlos]

Judging by carlos's over the top reactions and his inability to discuss/debate sensibly on anything i wouldnt even think about going to ForumCon. If anything, ForumCon should pay you to stop trying to advertise them as you are probably putting off people from going to that.

Then why are you here? To pester me? Go away and leave me alone. You really don't know how to leave other people alone. Do it already.

You've now said it repeatedly and forcefully without accepting that others say it isn't worth it. That's the definition of "insist".

It's worth it, but I'm not saying "hey! you have to go to forumcon." Seriously, stop putting words into my mouth. I'm not insisting. If you don't want to go, then don't!

 

[s.molinari]

I wonder had Kier, Mike or even Ashley announced they would be keynote speakers, how much different this poll would look.

I'd also like to understand the "nays" better. Most have said, "no value in going". Is it purely the perceived lack of possibly gaining some new knowledge (=value) against the costs the only reason for not going? It is a strong one, I must admit. It stops me too as the main reason.

Some say, it is too much advertising. That again means too little value.

I personally also get an impression of a less than adequate atmosphere or buzz around the conference. It lacks an air of professionalism, not because of the way it is carried out, but because of the cause it is supporting and how it goes about promoting/ marketing that cause. What is the cause? Is the cause, so forum owning "geeks" (said with endearment, cause I am one of them too!!!) can meet (i.e. networking)? Is it to give vendors a platform to advertise/ market their products? Is it for Viglink to make money and also actually get paid for doing their own marketing using this self-made marketing platform? Wouldn't that actually be a bit of conflict of interests? I think it is.

This is the said goal of the conference from the conference website...

Committed to sharing tips, tools, and best practices for managing, growing, and monetizing forums. ​

I can find that on the Internet. So, I really think the goals of the event and its results need re-evaluation. The conference needs a bit more distinction. A suggestion, the vendors could offer much more detailed break-out sessions about using their products. They then don't get charged for their presence, but rather pay by doing detailed training as a service. Let's have a lot less fluff please!

I understand organizing a show like ForumCon takes a good amount of effort and money and it is great something like it is being carried out for the forum and online community scene. However, even if I lived in SF, I'd be reluctant to pay to go there. If I did, I'd like to pay for the costs of food and service only, which at $75, would seem to be fair price to me. If that were to be the last minute price, I'd probably decide last minute to go, if I were in SF. For $200 or even $150? No way! Too expensive.

As I mentioned above, I also think the last thing Viglink should be doing is using it for their own purposes i.e. marketing platform, since it isn't "ViglinkCon". They should be very much in the background and that also doesn't seem to be the case really (despite Carlos' depictions). They should, at the most, also only offer detailed breakout sessions on using Viglink. The whole conference should be clearly a non-profit venture for them, IMHO. That doesn't seem to be the case, but to be fair and honest, I don't know that for sure. It is simply my impression and I know for a fact, conferences like this should NOT be about making any money and getting any additional advantages out of the meet for the organizer, IF the conference isn't about them.

So my suggestions, bring on much more detailed breakout sessions from the sponsoring vendors, which deliver intriguing knowledge about product specifics. Viglink should fall much more in the background and overall I think then the whole atmosphere around the meet could end up a couple of notches better.

Just my 2 cents.

Scott