Whilst this may sound harsh the response to that is quite simply "Tough luck". If you invested a significant amount of time and money on a business based around a piece of brand new software (in this case XF) and knew about the risks, it's your problem if it all folds and you end up with nothing. It's a calculated business risk.
California Case Update
- Thread starter Shamil
- Start date
- Status
John L.
Well-known member
Not to be a "Debbie Downer", but I'm not quite sure how any of this could be looked at in a positive light. While the software as it stands now works fine for my needs, it's been stale for quite a long time. It's not exactly what I'm looking for in a product regardless of the legal circumstances facing KAM. I'm by no means stating that the legal proceedings are not having an ill-effect on the team, but they're making it worse by not developing or giving us any information about the product.
Just some things that puzzle me about how this whole thing has been handled:
I know I'll never go back to vBulletin, that much is clear from their latest product. However, IPB becomes more and more appealing the more they continue to develop and actually make updates. Sorry if that is a bit much for some of the, awkwardly so, fanatical XF customers here...but it's the truth.
Just some things that puzzle me about how this whole thing has been handled:
- Wouldn't it make more sense to continue development in an effort to show that regardless of how the case moves forward they're confident in their stance.
- Wouldn't you want to have working demos and proper payment methods in order to increase your revenue to help cover the cost of the case.
- Wouldn't you say something in general about the mysterious absence of your key developer?
I know I'll never go back to vBulletin, that much is clear from their latest product. However, IPB becomes more and more appealing the more they continue to develop and actually make updates. Sorry if that is a bit much for some of the, awkwardly so, fanatical XF customers here...but it's the truth.
Actually if it was open sourced you'd find it would most likely get a pretty big following. The likes of phpBB would loose a lot of its developers and users to something like XF.
And on top of that, people just can't take this script and start magically developing for it after it's been abandoned and releasing that work to everyone.
You dont see people taking vBulletin 3.x series and continuing to support it and it's recent failures with newer php mysql versions do you? Which is part of the reason I've transitioned to XF (or am in the process!)
This script won't ever be open sourced. That's inane thinking.
Werent there already polls taken where the only reason people use this is because of who developed it. People don't want a thousand grubby handed coders meddeling in their projects.
psTubble27
Well-known member
Wait a second, I thought brogan never, "ever" said anything specific regarding xenforo. Totally "honest" am I right? Are you now saying that he does deal in dishonest myth and rumor after all? Why... I'M SHOCKED.
Maybe you should get brogan to clear his story first, before citing him as an example of anything reputable in this matter.
John
Well-known member
Yep, it is our "tough luck". But it's eventually yours, and everyone else's problem too when we're all gone and not making shiny new add on's and styles for you all to use.
Shelley
Well-known member
With the software not being developed 3rd party resource providers will end up going elsewhere, this hurts the ecosystem thus the adverse affects are fewer purchases. Add in the fact that 3rd part contributors contributing here are being told to leave hurts the ecosystem even more, even more so when they are met with verbal abuse. Where is the logic in that? When these concerned questions have passed there's still smug remarks in this thread with people referring to them as whiners, just to keep the argument ongoing. Again where is the logic in that one? it's just to argue for arguments sake because they've bickered and argued for so long it's what and all they know.
The software for me personally still needs much fixing. Smiley manager for example but it falls back on if there's no development, thus no new customers coming the vicious circle of no income, no developed will only spiral out f control thus 3rd party resource providers leaving because without a customer base it's just not worth their time building styles, add-ons because theres no point in spending time and money only to sell a few resources. Add in the fact when they ask questions again as stated above if they're being slated where is this in anyway helping xenforo?
I'll agree with your point never keep all your eggs in one basket. speaking for myself I could quite easily cancel my license today and walk away. But many have migrated here, spent time and money so they want to see this through but not with the developers hiding behind Jake/slavik
I'm sure I did make some trollish posts, at those that trolled me or did it via PC. I'm an eye for an eye type of person. Jake and slavik or one of the owners are free to ban me at anytime if they feel I've broke the rules.
I'm not blaming the software, the software is excellent, I'm not putting the blame on anyone specifically. What I am saying is 3rd party resource providers are being told to leave, met with verbal abuse, customers are asking for 5 minutes of the developers time to no avail so expecting customers to swallow this is unacceptable.
I know your not trolling, the response is not specific to you, you make good points. It wouldn't be so bad if the community stuck together atleast there would be something there, but there isn't it's divided because of the lack of communication amongst other adverse affects which I won't repeat because I stated that above.
I'm sure i got most of your post, sorry I haven't quoted it specifically.
Bottom line is I would like to see xenforo get through this so no amount of verbal abuse, or "move to another software" will push me out, i just hope 3rd party resource providers have this mindset and ignore this bashful part of xenforo because without a strong ecosystem, xenforo is going to be another dead software.
The software for me personally still needs much fixing. Smiley manager for example but it falls back on if there's no development, thus no new customers coming the vicious circle of no income, no developed will only spiral out f control thus 3rd party resource providers leaving because without a customer base it's just not worth their time building styles, add-ons because theres no point in spending time and money only to sell a few resources. Add in the fact when they ask questions again as stated above if they're being slated where is this in anyway helping xenforo?
I'll agree with your point never keep all your eggs in one basket. speaking for myself I could quite easily cancel my license today and walk away. But many have migrated here, spent time and money so they want to see this through but not with the developers hiding behind Jake/slavik
I'm sure I did make some trollish posts, at those that trolled me or did it via PC. I'm an eye for an eye type of person. Jake and slavik or one of the owners are free to ban me at anytime if they feel I've broke the rules.
I'm not blaming the software, the software is excellent, I'm not putting the blame on anyone specifically. What I am saying is 3rd party resource providers are being told to leave, met with verbal abuse, customers are asking for 5 minutes of the developers time to no avail so expecting customers to swallow this is unacceptable.
I know your not trolling, the response is not specific to you, you make good points. It wouldn't be so bad if the community stuck together atleast there would be something there, but there isn't it's divided because of the lack of communication amongst other adverse affects which I won't repeat because I stated that above.
I'm sure i got most of your post, sorry I haven't quoted it specifically.
Bottom line is I would like to see xenforo get through this so no amount of verbal abuse, or "move to another software" will push me out, i just hope 3rd party resource providers have this mindset and ignore this bashful part of xenforo because without a strong ecosystem, xenforo is going to be another dead software.
TPerry
Well-known member
In the 9th? I can't remember... aren't they one of the courts that gets overturned quite a bit on appeal?
SchmitzIT
Well-known member
Some people's businesses were built or transformed to be around XF... But hey, gotta break some eggs, eh?
jfp77
Active member
I purchased it today and am excited to be on board. I have to say, anything is better than my VB forum. I am so sick and tired of it and all its bugs and ancient admin panel. I think I'll just give the benefit of the doubt here and have faith that something great continues with XenForo, or at least the support of this community.
John
Well-known member
Glad to have you here, really are! We'll do all we can to help you out. Feel free to call on me, personally, if there's anything I could help you with.I purchased it today and am excited to be on board. I have to say, anything is better than my VB forum. I am so sick and tired of it and all its bugs and ancient admin panel. I think I'll just give the benefit of the doubt here and have faith that something great continues with XenForo, or at least the support of this community.
jfp77
Active member
Glad to have you here, really are! We'll do all we can to help you out. Feel free to call on me personally, if there's anything I could help you with.
Thank you John, so kind of you! As a newbie, I am sure there will be something I need help with at some point, so I appreciate your offer and will be in touch.
Oh I know - really I do. I hope I didn't come across as being a bit grumpy about it, as I really do appreciate that you chaps have made a big commitment.Yep, it is our "tough luck". But it's eventually yours, and everyone else's problem too when we're all gone and not making shiny new add on's and styles for you all to use.
Congrats on your purchase - you'll love itI purchased it today and am excited to be on board. I have to say, anything is better than my VB forum. I am so sick and tired of it and all its bugs and ancient admin panel. I think I'll just give the benefit of the doubt here and have faith that something great continues with XenForo, or at least the support of this community.
Shelley
Well-known member
Thank you John, so kind of you! As a newbie, I am sure there will be something I need help with at some point, so I appreciate your offer and will be in touch.
the support areas are excellent (jake does a fantastic job providing support), it's very seldom a post will go without a response so you have no worries if your needing support. Welcome to xenforo.
SchmitzIT
Well-known member
Thank you John, so kind of you! As a newbie, I am sure there will be something I need help with at some point, so I appreciate your offer and will be in touch.
Welcome to the family
Sheldon
Well-known member
And people wonder why no devs want to do anything.... wow.
Morgain
Well-known member
Shelley I don't know what you mean that you or other 3rd party developers have received abuse and been told to leave XF.
I have not seen that so perhaps it's happening behind the scenes. Whatever that is appalling and the moderators should help and protect you from any personal abuse about yourself.
Or perhaps you mean the active culture of speaking out and disagreement we see here. I do find people here whose manners are a bit rough sometimes and I don't like rude loutish comments being personal. But that happens in most communities and here far less than most. Some of it is me being classically older generdation not liking immaturity about manners - that point is centuries old!
I am one who has expressed exasperation with the whiners, perhaps that it what you disapprove?
Well my point on that is that the people who moan and whinge about lack of development, or prophesy doom, they have said their stuff many times over - and they have had enough answers to show that it's very unlikely to change before January. I have no objection to expressing complaint about lack of development. For some admins thats an issue. But there is no point in whining over and over again.
As several posts here recently have said it's for each of us to make a decision.
If someone urgently needs eg the Resource Manager to make their project work NOW, then XF is not right for them. A few months can be critical for some. But for others like me I have an excellent forum software that covers my needs.
Ive only just transferred one forum off VB3.6 !!!! It was chugging on fine without VB support for 6 years now; just it was a) boring; b) I hated the clunky admin and c) awkward design capacity. But it still worked. Worst case I could happily run on XF as it is now without much help for 5 years and beyond that who knows? Thats a century in net terms!
Being an admin = making my own business decisions. There's no big daddy or big mama to kiss it better.
Plus I don't approve of people spreading doom gloom and spiteful digs on XF when it's being bullied by VB. That's also a form of bullying. It's a Brit thing not to hit the little guy. Save the nastiness for VB - but pref not here as that lacks dignity. Plenty of other neutral admin forums for good rants though.
Point on absence of KAM? Kier has been here (posting on this thread) quite often since he had a holiday rest period in September. Mike has done some key troubleshooting on spam. They are clearly actively involved, but as Ashley announced Aug 31 on a minimum basis.
Basically if you like XF stay here and sit out the court case.
If you really desperately need features get them from addons, or use another software.
After the court case if you stayed on, we'll need to review the issues and what Kier and Mike do will be important.
I think myself Kier and Mike will keep going because this is their baby, they've invested a lot and it's established, and they stand to make seriously big money if they do. But that's`only my opinion.
I have not seen that so perhaps it's happening behind the scenes. Whatever that is appalling and the moderators should help and protect you from any personal abuse about yourself.
Or perhaps you mean the active culture of speaking out and disagreement we see here. I do find people here whose manners are a bit rough sometimes and I don't like rude loutish comments being personal. But that happens in most communities and here far less than most. Some of it is me being classically older generdation not liking immaturity about manners - that point is centuries old!
I am one who has expressed exasperation with the whiners, perhaps that it what you disapprove?
Well my point on that is that the people who moan and whinge about lack of development, or prophesy doom, they have said their stuff many times over - and they have had enough answers to show that it's very unlikely to change before January. I have no objection to expressing complaint about lack of development. For some admins thats an issue. But there is no point in whining over and over again.
As several posts here recently have said it's for each of us to make a decision.
If someone urgently needs eg the Resource Manager to make their project work NOW, then XF is not right for them. A few months can be critical for some. But for others like me I have an excellent forum software that covers my needs.
Ive only just transferred one forum off VB3.6 !!!! It was chugging on fine without VB support for 6 years now; just it was a) boring; b) I hated the clunky admin and c) awkward design capacity. But it still worked. Worst case I could happily run on XF as it is now without much help for 5 years and beyond that who knows? Thats a century in net terms!
Being an admin = making my own business decisions. There's no big daddy or big mama to kiss it better.
Plus I don't approve of people spreading doom gloom and spiteful digs on XF when it's being bullied by VB. That's also a form of bullying. It's a Brit thing not to hit the little guy. Save the nastiness for VB - but pref not here as that lacks dignity. Plenty of other neutral admin forums for good rants though.
Point on absence of KAM? Kier has been here (posting on this thread) quite often since he had a holiday rest period in September. Mike has done some key troubleshooting on spam. They are clearly actively involved, but as Ashley announced Aug 31 on a minimum basis.
Basically if you like XF stay here and sit out the court case.
If you really desperately need features get them from addons, or use another software.
After the court case if you stayed on, we'll need to review the issues and what Kier and Mike do will be important.
I think myself Kier and Mike will keep going because this is their baby, they've invested a lot and it's established, and they stand to make seriously big money if they do. But that's`only my opinion.
All I can say is that the XenForo developers have my full support. I trully have my fingers crossed for them and I hope that XenForo wins the case, because I plan on purchasing it the second I'm financially able to. I really want my board (which is a Jcink board right now) to run XenForo one day.
I also really hope that development will be resumed soon. I'm also following this thread very carefully so I can stay informed on what's going on and what will be going on with the software. But if XenForo ceases all further development permanently, I guess there's always IPB.
I also really hope that development will be resumed soon. I'm also following this thread very carefully so I can stay informed on what's going on and what will be going on with the software. But if XenForo ceases all further development permanently, I guess there's always IPB.
- Status