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Discussion in 'Off Topic' started by Sheldon, Aug 20, 2014.

  1. Sheldon

    Sheldon Well-Known Member

    Should it be made?

    I think it will be a better version than the first iteration, and its something I miss from back in the day... would be interesting to see a more modern version.
    Chris D likes this.
  2. Sheldon

    Sheldon Well-Known Member

    If curious, no, I am not fond of 7 or 8. I long for the days of yore.
    Chris D likes this.
  3. Chris D

    Chris D XenForo Developer Staff Member

    Personally, I'm waiting for 3.1.
    Sheldon likes this.
  4. RickM

    RickM Well-Known Member

    Nope it shouldn't. If anything Windows needs to be ditched, no more "oh its a new OS, its running Windows NT+1" bollocks. Scrap it, start again, and this time don't make really dumb decisions when building the OS (I.E registry and DLL libraries).

    It'd actually be a massive help if they did it on top of unix, but that'll never happen.

    Other things that need doing:

    - Dropping DirectX completely and using the MASSIVELY superior OpenGL.
    - Dropping the crappy exFat and NTFS filesystems
    - Dropping all the legacy nonsense, and entirely removing any consideration for 32bit
    - Move over to more standardised programming languages as the basis for the OS

    Essentially it'd not be Windows. Sure it can still carry the name, but it'd be a much slicker OS, not crippled by 20 year old code and crappy libraries and file storage methods. This is one of the main reasons (despite how some people refuse to admit it) OS X is far superior as an OS as a whole. It's built on a much cleaner foundation.

    As I said tho. It wont happen. MS will keep using the NT framework as a basis for it's operations for years. It's simply not cost effective to rebuild from scratch unless it's your last option.
  5. Mnikolic

    Mnikolic Member

    I agree with everything RickM said. Actually, I switched to Mac OS X because I noticed that some of my programs and hardware just work better under it than they ever did under Windows.

    Windows NEEDS to be re-coded. Give it a new UI (and by "new UI", I don't mean what Microsoft has done with 8). Make separate versions for desktop computers, laptops & tablets and mobile phones. No "Starter", "Professional" etc. crap. One version of the operating system can do just great, but have it modified for use on a specific device and offer the respective version under a fair price. Same goes for their software suits (Office, etc.). They could go even further and just have, for example, the Windows Installer detect how strong and capable a laptop is and based on that, have it modify the OS for use on that device. Weaker device = base install only, stronger device = full install (or something like that). Just no "editions" stuff. Apple has been doing 1 version of their OS for laptops for DECADES now and has learned to do everything I just mentioned. Hell, they even do that for iPhones, iPads, etc..
  6. Moshe1010

    Moshe1010 Well-Known Member

    After 15 years with Windows, I changed to OS X about a year ago. It was painful on the first month (many google searches for stupid stuff), but once I got used to the OS, I can't go back to Windows. Every time I open VM (Win 8.1), I just hate every moment I need to use it. There are always 500 updates available to download and some of them require multiple restarts, which drives me crazy. There is no application management app for Windows like there is one for Mac (MacUpdate), and the security of Windows is much inferior to OS X (which is unix based). Not to mention there are "no" viruses/malware for OS X (there are, but if you're not dumb and install random stuff from Warez websites, then you'll be fine).

    Should I mention multiple desktops, emulators for iPad/iPhone (xCode), iMessage, Faceetime, Synching between Apps with your cellphone (if you have iPhone), and much more will be introduced this year by iOS 8 and OS X 10.10 (e.g making calls from your OS X to real numbers (not skype based crap)).

    The only disadvantage of Macs is the price. If you can afford it, then it would probably a better choice. Most people that hate Macs (OS X), are those who used it for several days and gave up. You need to give at least a month to make a decision (and use it daily, for several hours).
    hcmagix and John like this.
  7. AdamD

    AdamD Well-Known Member

    I tried Mac (Or hackintosh I think it's called) on my PC, took a bit to get it working, but it's just too....different
    I didn't really give it a try, but I'm a games player for the most part, so it wouldn't really suit me.
    RickM likes this.
  8. RickM

    RickM Well-Known Member

    I get that. I first switched in 2007 and bought an iMac. It was not long after the Intel switch, and Bootcamp had just come out.

    A few months before that I'd switched to Linux as I was just so fed up with how crappy Windows was. My thinking behind the purchase was that even if I decided I didn't like OS X, I could stick Linux or Windows on it via Bootcamp.

    It took me at least 2 months before I was starting to get comfortable. Things really threw me to begin with. For example:

    - Why the hell is there no right click as default (this isnt the case any more, but at the time you had to manually turn on right-click)
    - What's with the ALT key being where the windows key is, what is the cmd key?!
    - Why is there no start menu
    - Where's my widgets?!

    To be honest though, a month in and you suddenly get a "oh I get it now" kind of moment. Once you adapt you realise how terribly planned out the Window UX is, and it soon becomes apparent how much attention to actualy USING the OS Apple had put into it.

    I maintain that nobody, anywhere, ever, regardless of proficiency with computers, can conclude one OS is better than the other by just using it for a week or two - you need to spend a good 3 months, and on decent hardware (I.e not a hackintosh - way too unreliable, and not even close to being the same experience as using the real thing).

    It's all the little things that make Windows crap, IMO. Poorly planned UI, terrible file management and structure, non-existant standards for file data storage. They may not sound like big things but they are the core OS problems. They are the reason why Windows is inherently a slow operating system.

    Combine that with the piss poor / non-existant roadmap, and it's just a terrible OS. I mean what the hell happened with Windows 8? It's like someone added in the touchscreen stuff as an afterthought, then someone else came along and said "Screw it, we'll make it only play nice on touchscreens", followed by someone else coming along and saying "No, we'll make it only play nice on a traditional mouse/keyboard system".

    Apple got it right. iOS and OS X are the two best operating systems, hands down. They're stable, very secure, very fast and have amazing long-term performance (i.e you don't need to reformat your computer every couple of years). Plus the OS is free, along with all upgrades. As is their office suite.

    The biggest issue OS X has right now is they've failed to upgrade OpenGL for a long time now, meaning some of the newer games coming out are having issues on it. Lots of game devs however are now realising that OpenGL is a way more powerful and easier to use system than DirectX, which is why so many more games are working on both OS X and Linux these days. Valve were a big reason for this. They published all their research showing just how much better OpenGL is.
    John likes this.
  9. Sheratan

    Sheratan Well-Known Member

    I tried Mac once, but switch to Windows again because I cant run my games in Mac.
  10. RickM

    RickM Well-Known Member

    Which game did you try running? The only game I've had issues with was Tropico 5, and that's only because it uses the newer OpenGL, which OS X hasn't get been given.
  11. Sheratan

    Sheratan Well-Known Member

    Dota 2, TF2, CoD series, Battlefield series. I heard it was some driver issue (nVIDIA)

    Some old RTS games like AoE 2, CoC General, etc cant run in Mac. :(
  12. RickM

    RickM Well-Known Member

    Check out Crossover by Codeweavers ;)

    Also TF2 has a native Mac version, as does Dota 2, several of the CoD games and Battlefield 2.

    Age of Empires 2, C&C Generals, AoE 3, etc all work in Crossover.

    The only one you listed that wont work on OS X is Battlefield 3. It'd work fine in Bootcamp however.
  13. TheRevTastic

    TheRevTastic Well-Known Member

    If I wasn't so big into PC gaming and had the money I would actually switch over, have wanted a mac for around 6 years now but I am a poor man.
  14. Jesepi

    Jesepi Well-Known Member

    Just out of curiosity - what did you not like about Windows 7? IMO it was in almost all ways a real improvement over what XP offered.
    BoostN likes this.
  15. Ernest L. Defoe

    Ernest L. Defoe Well-Known Member

    I didn't mind Windows 7. I actually found it to be a very stable OS from MS (if that's even possible) but when Windows 8 came out that was it for me and Windows. I bought a used MacBook Pro from a guy I know. He buys a new one every time there is a refresh or an updated better model and sells his old one. So I was able to snag up an early 2013 model for little to nothing. Since then I haven't looked back. Yeah I can't play some of the newer games like Titanfall and such until there is a Mac version released but I refuse to contaminate my machine by installing Windows on it either through Parallels or Bootcamp or any other method so oh well. When they release a version for Mac then I will play it.

    I just love have a computer that when I turn it on I know it's going to work and not have a bunch of issues. I remember Windows ME which was the biggest hunk of garbage to ever come out of MS until Windows 8 atleast Windows 8 is somewhat usable though.
  16. RickM

    RickM Well-Known Member

    It's way better than XP and 8, that's for sure. Arguably the most stable OS Microsoft has put out in years.

    It still has the fatal flaws of every Windows based operating system though:

    - Terrible filesystem
    - Terrible datastore (the registry)
    - Terrible long term performance
    - Terrible optimisation of the OS
    - Massive driver bloat
    - Inherently flawed security

    As a whole, Windows sucks at long-term performance. You shouldn't need to format your computer every couple of years. With regards to the lack of optimisation, take a look at the link below, where OS X manages 14 hours of battery life. On the same machine Windows gets 6 hours. That's not an insignificant difference. That's a massive screwup on Microsofts part and just highlights how bloated the OS is.


    I really wish they'd fix their issues but they seemingly dont care, and instead just keep slapping things into the OS that people really dont want. They need to do what Apple did a few years back. They spent about 2 years on Snow Leopard. Now, Snow Leopard didnt introduce a whole lot as an OS. It did however have a massive cleanup. They ditched a ton of legacy code, recoded a whole bunch of system apps and utilities, dropped old architecture supper and generally gave the OS a damn good tidy up. This really does show and it's carried through to their later released. The OS is just so well refined now that it's crazy fast. Photoshop on my Mac opens in under 2 seconds and I've not rebooted in over 6 months. That to me is a stable machine.

    Overall OS X is just better. It's not even an argument anymore. Sure, there are without a doubt things OS X is pretty crappy at (games used to be the primary candidate for this award, not so much anymore) but most of the nonsense that gets posted about it is pure lies. People still think OS X is the same as it was in 2006. It really isn't. It's such a clean, stable OS it's not even comparable anymore. I know there will be people who disagree, but to be frank, unless you've spent a LOT of time on BOTH operating systems (no, using your friends Mac for a week is not a long time), you've got no argument.
    ZeWildGuy likes this.
  17. TheRevTastic

    TheRevTastic Well-Known Member

    Oh another thing, I would immediately switch if we were able to build our own rigs like for Windows but using OS X and not have to make it a hackintosh.
    Sheratan likes this.
  18. RickM

    RickM Well-Known Member

    Don't expect that to happen ever :) That's why the OS is so streamlined - no unneeded drivers.
  19. AdamD

    AdamD Well-Known Member

    Is it just me, or do prior versions of MS operating systems mysteriously start to become unreliable/unstable, right after a new OS is brought out?
    XP Always used to be rock solid for me, then after Windows vista and then 7 came out, it started to get unreliable/unstable
    Now 8 is out, I'm noticing odd problems with 7, since the last few patches
    Conspiracy I say! :p
    RickM likes this.
  20. Sheratan

    Sheratan Well-Known Member

    This. I can build windows pc with only $350.

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