XF 2.4 XenForo 2.4 status and what's new under the hood?

Where are we?​

TL;DR: We're working hard to release XenForo 2.4 ASAP, but it's taking longer than expected due to scope changes and strategic decisions to wait for certain upstream developments that will benefit the long-term roadmap. Here's an analogy to explain why:

Software development is like planning a cross-country expedition with multiple destinations.

When you set out for version 2.4, you're not just driving to the next town over. You're charting a course through unknown territory with several strategic stops planned along the way - each representing a major milestone or feature release.

But the challenge is the landscape keeps changing along the journey.

• New roads open up (better technologies emerge)
• Bridges get washed out (dependencies break or become obsolete)
• You discover scenic routes that would benefit all future travellers (opportunities for architectural improvements)
• Weather conditions shift (market demands or user needs evolve)
• Your vehicle needs unexpected maintenance (technical debt must be addressed)

You can't just focus on reaching the immediate next stop. You must consider how each decision affects the entire journey ahead. Taking a shortcut to reach 2.4 faster might leave you stranded when trying to reach 3.0, 4.0 or even 5.0.

This is why scope changes occur: experienced developers are constantly recalibrating the route based on new information, ensuring the expedition can successfully reach not just the next destination, but all the strategic waypoints that follow.

The delays aren't detours, rather they're course corrections that keep the long-term journey viable.

To be slightly less cryptic, these are some of the specific challenges we have faced along the way:

A new Tiptap version is coming​

When we announced that Tiptap is coming to XenForo 2.4 it was 95% complete, and we then took a bit of a pause to work on other projects, which we have talked about since and will be discussing in this thread. Since then, Tiptap have announced Tiptap V3 which is currently in beta. Given how core the editor is to the forum experience, it makes a lot of sense to ship XenForo 2.4 with Tiptap V3 rather than Tiptap V2 as originally planned. While the changes involved are not too extensive, we also don't want to ship 2.4 with a dependency that is still in beta and subject to change. While we are not planning to wait for Tiptap V3 to be stable, necessarily, we do at least want to give it a little bit more time so we have a higher degree of confidence that we're shipping a stable editing experience.

We started talking about a rewrite (again)​

While this is not currently the direction we've decided to go in, it's responsible for us to at least consider all routes available to us to help us reach our destination.

After nearly 8 years since the release of XenForo 2.0, many of the technologies we use are showing their age, many of the decisions we made have started to slow us down more than we would like, and as a framework, XenForo becomes a less productive framework to work with. The solution to this problem can be to start from scratch, but we have ultimately decided that this is not something we need to do at this stage.

Instead, over the next few versions, including 2.4, we will be attempting to make iterative architectural changes to the framework so that we all have greater tools at our disposal to improve both the developer and user experience, particularly focusing on the implementation of developer tools and features that have become commonplace in other frameworks, such as Laravel.

Some of our best features are simply not finished​

There are one or two features that we see requested consistently from customers in our community forums and feedback channels, and we're excited to confirm they are coming in 2.4! However, it serves no one well if we release such highly-anticipated features before they are ready and before they have the usual level of quality, polish, and extensibility you would expect from a XenForo release. We'd rather take the extra time to get them right than rush them out and disappoint users with a subpar implementation that requires immediate patches or lacks the flexibility for customisation. We'll be sharing exciting details about what these features are and how they work in the coming weeks, so stay tuned!

We can't keep up!​

I just counted and there are about 15 features that have been merged or are pending to be merged into XF 2.4 that we haven't announced yet. Some of these are smaller and aren't worthy of a dedicated HYS of their own (so they'll probably be rolled into a "miscellaneous" HYS or two), and some of these are going to be mentioned below, but while we have been "cooking" (as the kids say these days) it has meant that things like code reviews, and writing HYS posts hasn't been easy to balance. There is also potentially more stuff coming from generous contributions from esteemed developers such as @Xon and @digitalpoint, assuming we have time to implement (otherwise they will wait for... a future version).


With all of that now being said, while 2.4 is taking longer than we wanted, we have been busy and we are very much nearing the end of development.

And, while disappointing (to all of us) it is important to maintain perspective. XenForo 2.2 was released in September 2020. XenForo 2.3 was released nearly four years later. XenForo 2.4 is not 3 more years away.

But, you clicked this to find out what's new, right? So let's go.

 

[smallwheels]

I think if all the devs did was simply keep customers more informed of current progress, much of this negative speculation would go away.

Possibly. Or maybe not. Some people will always be there that will have completely unrealistic expectations and additionally only hear what they want to hear (and insist on the limited things that they decided to hear). In software development, especially in phases of refactoring or with things like replacing an editor there may be longer phases where simply no progress can be reported as for a non dev there is none.

It's a basic thing called expectation management and once again, demonstrates the importance of good quality communication with your customers.

Yes - but this is two sided: XF created wrong expectations in the first place (which was a failure) and then not only failed to keep up to them but also to communicate in a timely manner - but then it is also on the customers to manage their own expectations to stay realistic and to avoid coming into disappointment and/or rage mode and cynicism. Some do better than others I'd say.

 

[Digital Doctor]

XF created wrong expectations in the first place (which was a failure) and then not only failed to keep up to them but also to communicate in a timely manner

Well before Xenforo was created Kier learned at vbulletin learned to not promise anything until you know you can deliver. That's why xenforo never discloses what they are going to release or when. FROM DAY 1. For 15 years in a row.

So people thinks they, after 15 years, abandoned this policy. For no reason.

u sure ?

to me, the delay, is not about the code, it's something else, and that something else is a timeframe they can't control, and it will have to play out until it is resolved.

 

[Mendalla]

Well before Xenforo was created Kier learned at vbulletin learned to not promise anything until you know you can deliver. That's why xenforo never discloses what they are going to release or when.

Except they were pretty clear that 2.4 was coming in Q1 of this year, which is now long behind us. That's why there's so much discontent over the lack of any news. Based on statements made early in the process, we were supposed to be on 2.4 by now. Once that was said, communication about why they didn't release then and when we might see a release becomes imperative. Yes, this supports the point you are making, why a software company would avoid a "roadmap" with fixed release dates, but they did give a pretty clear timeline for 2.4 and now that's haunting them.

I'm in shrug mode myself. I'll look at it when it comes. 2.3 is working nicely for us, even if I wouldn't mind the new editor assuming it fixes the odd issues Firefox is having with Froala.

 

[Mouth]

Some unknown day in the future there will be a 2.4 with a new editor and later, perspectively, way further in the future, a 3.0 with a new style.

And thus no reason for me to pay for an annual extensions for XF until I see something worth renewing for. Nowadays I have far less loyalty and interest in XF, paying my annual extensions to support XF and contributing to/with the community, because I do not get any benefit or upgrade in having an active support/updates agreement and have little to offer or engage with. I last renewed in 2023 because of the statement that 2.3 and 3.0 were coming, and 2.3 gave me nothing worth the resource/effort in upgrading and purchasing/upgrading 2.3 compatible addon's. No reason to renew in 2024, and already no reason in 2025.

XF has effectively become stagnate for me in the last 2 years, and I'm now treating it as so into the future until someday maybe we see an upgrade, and it contains something compelling to me. Nothing in 2.4 HYS's so far that compels me. So with past trends, dev/release cycles for production versions, and waiting time for must-have add-on's to be compatible, even if an XF release was imminent (which is not the case) I'm looking at least Q2, probbaly more so Q3, next calendar year before it maybe comes worthwhile purchasing an XF extension.

The flow-on is that it also becomes the same with add-on's devs/products. Because XF isn't releasing new versions that either provide a compelling reason to upgrade and/or come within a year, I'm not paying for extensions/upgrades with add-on's either because I have no need for their XF 2.3 supported products and likewise have less engagement with their community's because there's little for me to offer or engage with.

to me, the delay, is not about the code, it's something else, and that something else is a timeframe they can't control, and it will have to play out until it is resolved.

Hmmm ... you mean like a sale or restructure of the company?

 

[Lee]

Hmmm ... you mean like a sale or restructure of the company?

This is my guess.

 

[Digital Doctor]

Except they were pretty clear that 2.4 was coming in Q1 of this year, which is now long behind us

The problem came up after the promises.

 

[Digital Doctor]

Hmmm ... you mean like a sale or restructure of the company?

along those lines, yes.

 

[Rusty Snippets]

Well, I just renewed my license, so you all can release 2.4 now. Thanks!!

 

[Digital Doctor]

Well, I just renewed my license, so you all can release 2.4 now. Thanks!!

reminds me of when I just bought a xenforo license because they got sued by vBulletin.

 

[Kirby]

to me, the delay, is not about the code, it's something else, and that something else is a timeframe they can't control, and it will have to play out until it is resolved.

Nobody expect XenForo staff knows for sure, but I'd call this FUD.

2.3 was clearly delayed due to the removal of jQuery and the CSS changes (style variants, FontAwesome SVG).
Personally I would not have expected such big breaking changes within 2.X.

From a developer perspective I'd also expect the DBAL to be a significant and rather complicated task which IMHO can easily cause delays.

 

[Slavik]

Hmmm ... you mean like a sale or restructure of the company?

The company hasnt been sold or restructured.

 

[Digital Doctor]

XenForo staff knows

How do you explain the relative absence of most staff ? the relative return of slavik ?
and how do you explain why gravity isn't quantizable ?