Add-on Where do you stand on selling addons to Russian businesses?

Stuart Wright

Stuart Wright

Well-known member
Don’t want to get political but I always vet the forums I sell my addons to and I don’t feel comfortable doing business with a Russian organisation. I’m inclined to decline their request to purchase.

Where do you stand on this?

(FYI I won’t sell licenses to use our addons to competing forums or forums doing dodgy things like sharing stolen login credentials. That’s why vet all purchase requests.)
 
I understand the hesitation, but I think it’s important to remember that Russians are human beings regardless of nationality. While governments and politics can be complicated, individuals shouldn’t automatically be judged by where they’re from. Each case deserves to be considered on its own merits, and treating people with fairness and dignity strengthens communities everywhere.

As far as selling to competing forums, why not? What are you scared of? is the question that I think of.
 
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I will say, Devs that take that kind of approach, I'll never buy from.

You can vet me, Stu, as you're on my do-not-do-business-with list.

And it doesn't surprise me to see people like Digital Doctor liking posts like this one.
 
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Jake70 said:
Devs that take that kind of approach, I'll never buy from.
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What approach?
My post is asking about doing business with Russian businesses. My first reaction is that it makes me feel uncomfortable.

The good Russian people obviously are not the government and I do sympathise with them.
Jake70 said:
As far as selling to competing forums, why not? What are you scared of? is the question that I think of.
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My post really isn’t about this - I added the FYI because I wanted to briefly explain why we vet purchases at all.
To answer your question - Because some of our addons were originally developed for us only (at great expense) and later released under the condition that the business advantage that they bring be not shared with a very small number of our direct competitors. Business owners who do not consider protecting their IP could be being negligent.
 
tajhay said:
I take the approach you have to sell to everyone or be consistent ie if you dont sell to Russia, then its quite hypocritical to be selling to Israel and USA etc.
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I do distinguish between individuals, businesses and governments. I’m not asking about selling to Russia, Israel or the USA - by which I take you to mean their governments (I think all governments have done or are doing horrendous acts).
I’m asking about a forum which looks to me like a business and which refers to the rules of the Russian Federation a number of times in their information page.
I haven’t made a decision, yet. I asked the question to get other perspectives to help me make the best decision. I appreciate the replies.
 
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Stuart Wright said:
Where do you stand on this?
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Difficult queston. The most obvious thing to check would be if the sale would be affected by official sanctions against Russia anyway. Apart from that: While not all people in Russia might agree with the country's actions the idea of sanctions is to generate pressure by making life less comfortable for people in Russia. A lot of companies worldwide have stopped selling to Russia and if I was in your situation I would clearly consider to join them.

I would also check, if payment would be possible at all (are things like paypal etc. still possible from Russia?) and it would also be interesting how i.e. XF themselves handle sales to Russia.
 
smallwheels said:
I would also check, if payment would be possible at all (are things like paypal etc. still possible from Russia?) and it would also be interesting how i.e. XF themselves handle sales to Russia.
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International payments and payment systems do not work in Russia. Usually, when a Russian business or individual makes a purchase, they use intermediaries or banks in other countries. So, from a formal point of view, the seller will not have any problems, and sometimes the seller will not even suspect that they are selling the product to a buyer from Russia/for russian users. Yes, this applies not only to Russia — you can never be 100 percent sure where, how, and for what purposes your products will be used.

Therefore, it all comes down to personal perception, the concept of collective responsibility, and conformity (if sanctions prohibit it, then I must also comply).
 
Jake70 said:
I understand the hesitation, but I think it’s important to remember that Russians are human beings regardless of nationality. While governments and politics can be complicated, individuals shouldn’t automatically be judged by where they’re from. Each case deserves to be considered on its own merits, and treating people with fairness and dignity strengthens communities everywhere.

As far as selling to competing forums, why not? What are you scared of? is the question that I think of.
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It's easy to make such statements when you're not the one faced with possible legal ramifications by doing business with someone in an embargoed country. While it's probably okay because it fits under non-advanced, and civilian use, the cost of consulting an attorney for a definitive answer is more than the cost of the sale. I'd pass if it were my business, and did for similar reasons when a Cuban forum asked for my help on a project.
 
Stuart Wright said:
Where do you stand on this?
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I'm glad you asked about this. If your business ethics policy is based on geopolitical conflicts, then I hope you apply it consistently. Otherwise it stops being an ethical stance and becomes just selective moral discomfort.

To me, Russia, Israel, Palestine, Turkey all fall into the same category. But I notice you don’t seem to feel uncomfortable selling add-ons to, for example, China, even though they have been occupying Tibet since the 50s, Morocco for the invasion of Western Sahara in 1976, Turkey for the annexation of Northern Cyprus, Indonesia for the invasion of East Timor and the genocide of 250,000 people? Or the USA/UK for the invasions of Iraq without UN Security Council approval based on personal beliefs about weapons of mass destruction?

This looks less like a principled approach and more like a 'rules-based order' applied only to non-allied states which is exactly where double standards come from.

And your feeling of 'discomfort' seems to be caused by double standards as well.

My approach is simple, either we sell to everyone under clear rules, or we don’t pretend we’re running the UN Security Council here.
 
It's too bad this has turned into the Spanish Inquisition with @Ferry questioning another person's motivations, standards, principles and morals.

Trailer Creed GIF
 
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