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Tags suggestions for better usage and management. Canonical tags and synonyms

Discussion in 'XenForo Suggestions' started by Stuart Wright, Jul 5, 2015.

Tags:
  1. Stuart Wright

    Stuart Wright Well-Known Member

    I didn’t use tags in vBulletin and don’t use Xentag, so tags are a foreign concept to AVForums users. Despite this, I am excited about using tags because of this post XF SEO Tweaks by @ForestForTrees which extolls the organised, comprehensive and apparently productive use of tags at Stack Exchange for SEO benefit.

    For ideas, I’ve been looking through the tag related suggestion threads

    https://xenforo.com/community/search/7158266/?q=tags&t=post&o=replies&g=1&c[date]=1435186800&c[title_only]=1&c[node]=18

    and I’ve referred to some of them here as part of my overall suggestion which includes canonical tags and synonyms. I also wanted to promote discussion and get feedback.

    Creating tags

    Who creates the tags? Since forums grow through the value of the community and the useful content it produces, I think the membership should create tags.

    However I think that members will need to be encouraged to create tags. I'm not sure about making at least one tag compulsory per new thread because members might type in trash just to get the thread posted.
    To mitigate this, could we have a method of suggesting tags based on the contents of the thread title and first post? This suggestion is interesting: Use elastic search's significant terms aggregation for automatic/suggested thread tags

    Certainly if pertinent tags are created by default then members are more likely to ‘take ownership’ of those tags, removing ones they don’t like and adding their own suggestions before they hit the final ‘Create Thread’ button.

    When suggesting tags, is it worth considering weighting the suggested tags by the forum/media category/resource category they are being used in? It seems to me that If we’re suggesting tags for a new thread in a particular forum then the existing tags used in threads in that forum are likely to be more relevant.
    I also think there is discussion to be had with regard to having an automated process running through all existing threads to create tags. Any tag related search which omits the two million tagless existing threads on AVForums is bound to be unsatisfactory.
    Any such process would need to be clever and efficient, of course.

    Canonical tags and synonyms

    I think we should remove duplication by setting up synonyms for tags and automatically replacing the synonyms with a preferred (or ‘canonical’) one. I think this is important because it allows us to define exactly what the preferred tags are (which is good for clarity and SEO) and then ensure less dilution of tags and SEO by always using the canonical ones.

    For example, if we had the canonical tag of ‘4K UHD (Ultra HD)’ then any synonym (e.g. 4K, UHD, Ultra HD, Ultra High Definition) would automatically get changed to the canonical ‘4K UHD (Ultra HD)’ tag.

    Creating synonyms would be the moderators’ job and once a tag is set up to be a synonym of another tag, then that tag would effectively be replaced by the canonical version in all content. (If this causes duplication of tags then the duplicates are deleted).

    Managing tags

    Should moderators be responsible for managing tags? I’m thinking so, and if so we need a front-end method of managing them. They will need to be able to delete tags, change them, and set up canonical tags and their synonyms. I think we ought to discuss tag descriptions, also. Like a mini-wiki for each tag.

    The moderators would need to be able to find similar tags as suggested here Find and merge similar thread tags so that they could delete or merge the ‘bad’ or synonym tags into the canonical one.

    And seeing what tags are popular as per this suggestion Show tag popularity when selecting tags might help the moderators decide on what is the best canonical tag to use.

    Reporting tags

    I definitely think we need a way to report tags separately from the content they are associated with. Even with the censor and spam phrase filters being used on tags, there are going to be the spammy and inappropriate ones posted and we will want to deal with the creators of those tags. A suggestion here for reporting bad tags Report bad tags

    Watch tags

    I think the ability to watch tags would be an awesome feature Watch thread tags

    They have a ‘subscribe’ facility over at Stack Exchange. In fact I think it would be useful to look at the tag functionality they have at Stack Exchange and cherry pick the best bits.
    1.jpg

    There are plenty of other good suggestions on what to do with the tag data, but I think what’s important at this stage is focussing on getting the tag data as relevant, focussed and useful as possible via suggestions, synonyms and good tag management with front-end moderator tools.
     
    Last edited: Jul 5, 2015
    Brad L, MrDeranged, viper357 and 14 others like this.
  2. DeltaHF

    DeltaHF Well-Known Member

    All excellent recommendations. I'd love to see a "watch tag" feature.
     
  3. Stuart Wright

    Stuart Wright Well-Known Member

    Having used tags for some time with the Tag Essentials addon, I'd like to further expand on what improvements I think are necessary to the core tag functionality.

    The manage tags page needs to 'remember' the last used choices for filter and sort order. It's incredibly infuriating to have to re-sort the list when I want to manage the most popular tags.

    We definitely need the ability to block specific tags (not using wildcard by default). For example, on AVForums people are repeatedly adding tags like
    • 32gb
    • black
    • space gray
    • space grey
    • unlocked
    • unmarked
    • s3
    • 6 plus
    • two
    I think tags which are adjectives are useless and we need to stop the use of them.
    As are elements of product descriptions like 6 plus which always proceeds iPhone and when used together adjacently need to be automatically joined together as one tag.
    And other extremely common words like two are utterly pointless as tags.
    To a degree there is some education required, but people will always enter useless tags, and we need to block the common ones.

    We also need to differentiate between the use of certain words.
    For example, people generally use the word galaxy in reference to the Samsung products. But they could also be referring to the delicious chocolate or the gravitationally bound system of stars, stellar remnants, interstellar gas and dust, and dark matter.
    How would we know which the tag is referring to?
    So I would want the use of Samsung and Galaxy together in a thread be replaced with a single Samsung Galaxy tag.
    And create variations for the other uses like Galaxy (chocolate) and Galaxy (astronomical phenomena) and not allow people to use the tag Galaxy.

    This is, of course, assuming that people dive a damn about the tags. Which some people won't, of course, but honestly I think if they are to be useful, they need to be managed.
     
    arms, MrDeranged, Xon and 4 others like this.

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