Sex Offender Signs Publicly Identify Convicted Predators In Florida

I'm going under the assumption that these individuals are 100% guilty and that the victims are indeed victims of terrible, terrible crimes.
The problem is how they determine who is guilty, if it is the guys word vs the girls and you have a jury, you have a guilty man.

At one point this man was guilty until they found he wasn't and released him from jail..
http://www.ctnewsjunkie.com/ctnj.php/archives/entry/new_dna_evidence_sets_hartford_man_free/

this guy too

James Tillman served 18 years in Connecticut prisons before DNA testing proved his innocence. Last week, the state legislature approved a bill awarding him $5 million in compensation for the injustice he suffered. The bill now goes to Governor Jodi Rell, who has said she will sign it.


The only reason they were released is because there actually was dna evidence on file...if there wasn't they would still be in jail. How many other people are in jail based on shoddy evidence because of accusations that were false. That is an unknown but I bet it is a lot.

Hartford Courant, 5/21/07
I'm still against this if the individuals are already done paying their debt to society. It is my view that if said debt has been paid, then that person is as free as is allowed. If it was a felony there are restrictions already set in place, such as voting in some places and gun ownership. If the crime was not labeled a felony (highly doubtful in this in stance) then that person is as free as you or I.
I think the solution to prosecuting actual rapists and sentencing them in a way where they can not hurt anyone anymore would involve taking more seriously the possibly that the girl is lying and until there is actual cold evidence not prosecute either party. When one proves the other is lying with facts and evidence , the other should go to jail forever.

If things worked like that...there would be less false accusations and that would free up resources to do a more thorough investigation on the remaining accusations which would probably lead to less innocent people going to jail and also remove people who really are rapists from society.

If you don't like this, then you need to work on getting the punishment phase changed. It would be like telling you you have a fine to pay and then after you've paid it off they tell you that you owe more just because. You know of empirical instances where the current laws didn't work? I agree. Sometimes these things slip through the cracks. But there are also instances where people really are rehabilitated. What about these people? You have to remember that prison and our justice system is SUPPOSED to be about rehabilitation, not revenge.

The only problem is jail does not rehabilitate most inmates at all. I know a few people who served lengthy bids, they came out more criminal than they went in. Pretty much you adapt to survive in your surroundings or you don't survive
and jail is no different.

But like you said there will be people who realize that they were wrong and that they don't want the life they used to lead, and those people would have no future as an honest citizen if they are publicly shamed for the rest of their life. And then there is that person who wasn't a rapist and let's say was 20 years old having consensual sex with a 17 year old, putting a sign on their lawn is overkill and WILL ruin their life. Technically though, they are a sex offender so if these signs are mandated they will get one.


I know how you are going to read this - that I feel for the criminal and not the victim - but to me in this case both are actually immaterial. It's not about whether the signs in question are the right thing to do. I say they are not because it's a form of double-jeopardy, which is unconstitutional.

I understand EXACTLY what you are saying...and it is completely logical and sound. You can't be tried for the same crime twice, just like you can't be punished after you have served your sentence.

The other thing is the punishment itself is unconstitutional...
Under Amendment VIII of the US constitution cruel and unusual punishment is outlawed. Lifetime public humiliation of someone convicted of statutory rape definitely qualifies as a gross violation of constitutional law.
 
I think we should all step back from individualized empirical examples and stick with the overarching situation. Most examples I've seen are the exception and not the norm.
Societies larges, biggest, and most stupidest "cop out" (excuse or dismissal)

"X is an exception and not the rule"
"X is an exception and not the norm"

You know... This same excuse is repeated throughout history. It was widely used when the concept of "separate, but equal" was the norm.

Yes, largest cop out of all time. Keeps repeating through out history.... Typically when the facts are politically incorrect and / or socially not accepted.
 
Explain how that is a wannabe lawyer....

I do know someone who is in jail for something he didn't do...this is not fairy tale land, and there will never be a happy ending for him...this is a dude sitting in a jumpsuit in a room about the size of your closet for a decade or about 1/7 th of his life because of a false accusation.

Now if you were to put a sign on his lawn stating he was a rapist when he DOES get out of jail, it WILL for a FACT do a few things.

People will bring race issues up...and start violent acts based on that, it will start with a brick through someones window but it wont end there.

People will see that sign and it will trigger thoughts of what kind of monster is behind that door. Eventually they will act...this will also be violent.

And lets not forget about my friend who would have just gotten out of jail, do you think after 10 years surviving in the box with dudes who WILL stab you over ramen noodles that he has lost nothing...perhaps some innocence?

Do you really think when someone gets in his face calling him N* this or rapist that those 10 years of surviving in jail aren't going to make him defend himself and do you think that if you spent a decade in jail you would take kindly to someone rubbing your false imprisonment in your face .

I don't think so and in the case I explained, you now have an innocent man who is acting like a criminal because he is rightfully defending his honor or whats left of what has been stripped from him.





This is not what if...this is a real situation involving people that I used to chop-em down with. I described something that exists in my life and that situation WOULD be drastically changed for the worse if you included these signs. Maybe where you are rape is nothing and treated lightly...but over here every girl knows that if they cry rape people will come running to their rescue.

And in the end if she was a dirty whore that wouldn't matter because she wont be jailed for that and your brother will be picking up soap for his new room-mates because all people heard was rape.

Nobody runs to a grown mans rescue when he is falsely accused, every person is so stuck on the word rape that they can't see past the fact that he might not be guilty and then it is like people only say bad stuff about the guy or say nothing at all...because of some forced sociably acceptable views on the topic.

I knew a girl that used to act sweet and take things from men..if they didn't buy the sweet act and said 'nah girl, I need that back' she would say something like 'It's mine or I scream one word loudly and that word is rape', and guys would basically be chumped and robbed by a girl and she only had to say one key word.

Here is an interesting situation, not related to rape...though if you flip the situation around and it was a guy attacking a girl i'm sure everyone would think he was going to rape her...but when she attacks him..99% of people just sit there and say nothing and let it happen.
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In the end any thing you can prosecute for....needs to have a harsher penalty for falsely accusing of, otherwise just like that court case you mentioned, one side will always pervert the law in order to legally attack someone, just like in that case and just like in the case where my friend went to jail.

Keep going, I'm reading so far, you've brought nothing to the table. Apart from some maybes a possible fact and a whole lot of what ifs.

For every 1 person you list to me who is innocent and got convicted. I can probably list 5 real world people who were raped/abused and the abuser was left to go free without punishment not even anything printed on record but since I'm not going to name those here for you and your pleasure then just lets say, I wont.

Let's just say if a woman screams rape and she's found to be guilty of this of falsely accusing then the jail term should be that of an abuser or a very lengthy one, written on her record sign post up (more subtle what I said before) on this there should be sentence as this destroys a person life not something I turn a blind eye to.

What did I mean by the wannabe comment?

Well, it's ironic that when there's a lawsuit the lawyers come out. When a SO thread is created a "I knew/know someone is innocent" when infact that there such a high probability that you are more likely to know of SO than a person that was innocently convicted of abusing.

What about your law that allows guilty SO to get off scott free? I see no arguments towards and that's where my selfish comment from earlier came from, not because of the stuff you provide but selfishness in this manner that people turn a blind eye to this. You know, it's common knowledge that victims will not say they have been abused because they are likely not to be believed even by their families and there's a high probability that the abuser is a family member hence the blind eye by many.

I'll leave it there, quite frankly this thread disgusts me or rather some individuals in it protecting these scum of the earth. I'll leave it that don't quote me, if you have anything to say, say it I'll read it still.
 
Keep going, I'm reading so far, you've brought nothing to the table. Apart from some maybes a possible fact and a whole lot of what ifs.
My friend IS in jail, he WAS accused of rape, the accuser did lie to protect herself, he DOES have a permanent mark on his name, and he IS still in jail. That is fact. And it is a fact that women know they can cry rape in this country and get paid or send someone to jail. If you want to argue talk to someone in this country who actually lives in a place with lots of people and they will tell you...as a male in this country who at one point was very interested in finding a mate I did what every other male does in this country and not try to end up with a foul chick...girls who cry rape fall under foul chicks and that is also commonly known. This is not a what if...it is a reality that I have to be cautious because a chick trying to extort me or abuse me is a reality and my friend in jail reminds me of that.


For every 1 person you list to me who is innocent and got convicted. I can probably list 5 real world people who were raped/abused and the abuser was left to go free without punishment not even anything printed on record but since I'm not going to name those here for you and your pleasure then just lets say, I wont.
So all I read here is that you live in a country with less guns and more rape and bad laws surrounding the issue. Perhaps a system meant to look better than be better is the culprit, I dunno though...I live in the US. I also think that you are more manipulative than anyone in this thread with you trying to imply that I take pleasure in hearing about people who were raped. This is called shifting the scope of the exchange which is a technique used to detract from the fact that your arguments argue with me instead of arguing the merits of an idea, I suppose I can try that though.


What did I mean by the wannabe comment?

Well, it's ironic that when there's a lawsuit the lawyers come out. When a SO thread is created a "I knew/know someone is innocent" when infact that there such a high probability that you are more likely to know of SO than a person that was innocently convicted of abusing.
Under what premise are you stating that...maybe YOU in YOUR country have more victims than liars, but over here there are way more liars than rape victims. Also I gave multiple examples of WHY these signs do more damage than good (which they do none). You don't seem to understand how even being accused of a sex crime in this country will in most cases ruin your life. You also don't seem to observe the laws of the US where public humiliation is ILLEGAL at a federal/constitutional level and no state govt can over ride that legally.

What about your law that allows guilty SO to get off scott free?
I have not seen a law that says SO is permissible. Please ref. section and title.

I see no arguments towards and that's where my selfish comment from earlier came from, not because of the stuff you provide but selfishness in this manner that people turn a blind eye to this.
I am not turning a blind eye to this...I am telling you that my friend was convicted on a testimony of fantasy and lies...innocent people go to jail for it...i can not comment because you are way off...how you see this is not how it happens in this country. The signs are illegal, you cant break the law to enforce the law and you can't break the law in execution of a sentence.

You know, it's common knowledge that victims will not say they have been abused because they are likely not to be believed even by their families and there's a high probability that the abuser is a family member hence the blind eye by many.

This is also subjective not every person is the same...most women I know would not hesitate to report it. It is not like this is 1920 where shame was first thing on the girls mind...in a world where men and women treat each other more as equals and women are less submissive, the first thing most women are going to do is get angry and scream bloody murder...because the community is not going to shun them for it like things used to be...they are going to shun the rapist and almost always take the side of the victim; lying or telling the truth.


I'll leave it there, quite frankly this thread disgusts me or rather some individuals in it protecting these scum of the earth. I'll leave it that don't quote me, if you have anything to say, say it I'll read it still.

This thread is about sex offenders in Florida and laws being made which set the precedent for more violations of the constitution to be made. It is all a matter of steps. If you believe in something you have to fight for it. I believe these signs make everyone who is a citizen of my country a victim, because allowing signs for this opens the door to allowing them for anything.
 
My friend IS in jail, he WAS accused of rape, the accuser did lie to protect herself, he DOES have a permanent mark on his name, and he IS still in jail. That is fact. And it is a fact that women know they can cry rape in this country and get paid or send someone to jail. If you want to argue talk to someone in this country who actually lives in a place with lots of people and they will tell you...as a male in this country who at one point was very interested in finding a mate I did what every other male does in this country and not try to end up with a foul chick...girls who cry rape fall under foul chicks and that is also commonly known. This is not a what if...it is a reality that I have to be cautious because a chick trying to extort me or abuse me is a reality and my friend in jail reminds me of that.



So all I read here is that you live in a country with less guns and more rape and bad laws surrounding the issue. Perhaps a system meant to look better than be better is the culprit, I dunno though...I live in the US. I also think that you are more manipulative than anyone in this thread with you trying to imply that I take pleasure in hearing about people who were raped. This is called shifting the scope of the exchange which is a technique used to detract from the fact that your arguments argue with me instead of arguing the merits of an idea, I suppose I can try that though.



Under what premise are you stating that...maybe YOU in YOUR country have more victims than liars, but over here there are way more liars than rape victims. Also I gave multiple examples of WHY these signs do more damage than good (which they do none). You don't seem to understand how even being accused of a sex crime in this country will in most cases ruin your life. You also don't seem to observe the laws of the US where public humiliation is ILLEGAL at a federal/constitutional level and no state govt can over ride that legally.


I have not seen a law that says SO is permissible. Please ref. section and title.


I am not turning a blind eye to this...I am telling you that my friend was convicted on a testimony of fantasy and lies...innocent people go to jail for it...i can not comment because you are way off...how you see this is not how it happens in this country. The signs are illegal, you cant break the law to enforce the law and you can't break the law in execution of a sentence.



This is also subjective not every person is the same...most women I know would not hesitate to report it. It is not like this is 1920 where shame was first thing on the girls mind...in a world where men and women treat each other more as equals and women are less submissive, the first thing most women are going to do is get angry and scream bloody murder...because the community is not going to shun them for it like things used to be...they are going to shun the rapist and almost always take the side of the victim; lying or telling the truth.




This thread is about sex offenders in Florida and laws being made which set the precedent for more violations of the constitution to be made. It is all a matter of steps. If you believe in something you have to fight for it. I believe these signs make everyone who is a citizen of my country a victim, because allowing signs for this opens the door to allowing them for anything.

So bottom line your worried about your day to day life being disrupted and concerned your going to loose some of the luxuries you adore so much this is what your fighting for not what is right. This was never about the signposts.
 
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He's a cop and a sexual predator ? Weird.
(just kidding).​
 
So bottom line your worried about your day to day life being disrupted and concerned your going to loose some of the luxuries you adore so much this is what your fighting for not what is right. This was never about the signposts.

So bottom line is you took everything I said and over simplified it to try and make me sound like an a-hole in an attempt to devalue the idea behind of any of the content which I have posted.

Nothing about it is luxury...amendment VIII of the US constitution protects as a basic right against public humiliation as punishment of a crime and for good reason...it sets a bad precedent.

And this is in fact about the signs...

http://xenforo.com/community/threads/sex-offender-signs-publicly-identify-convicted-predators-in-florida.50621


and if you look at what a registered sex offender must do, the signs in comparison really have no benefit to anyone...it is a feel good law meant to shut people up and in reality it will do nothing but make more problems of a different kind.


To me all they symbolize is illegal procedure in direct violation of one of the main principles of the constitution and no state Florida included can just ignore parts of the major document which grants the basic things you can count on in this country and sets the framework for constructing law.

For those really interested in this issue, I suggest taking a look at the actual statute that authorizes the signs:

http://www.leg.state.fl.us/Statutes...ing=&URL=0700-0799/0775/Sections/0775.21.html

you should really look at the link in this quote...sex offenders are not all en masse getting away scott-free as you put it and there is a quite the list of things a sexual offender must comply with after being released from jail...

And yes, I do not want to see signs all over the place talking about sex offenders, no more than I want to be around people who are actually sexual predators.

I agree with your sentiment that if a lunatic runs around raping kids or subdued or helpless people that they should get some form of the bobbit, but you are way out of line in saying that everyone who thinks that violating constitutional law is not OK is protecting sex offenders.

I am on the side of the people and the laws that protect them, breaking laws to enforce other laws and breaking laws in sentencing are a scary incremental step into taking away freedoms and general corruption and oppression.




Everything I posted I believe to be fact and if you don't understand them you shouldn't involve yourself with them while accusing others of supporting sexual offenders because if you look at it from my perspective...

you are posting 'a public sign' yourself stating that I am in support of something that is shameful and completely untrue in vengeance for me not agreeing with you...quaint.

No, posting public signs won't get out of control at all:rolleyes: .
 
Nothing about it is luxury...amendment VIII of the US constitution protects as a basic right against public humiliation as punishment of a crime and for good reason...it sets a bad precedent.

You realize as a convicted felon, you lose some of your constitutional rights?
 
So bottom line is you took everything I said and over simplified it to try and make me sound like an a-hole in an attempt to devalue the idea behind of any of the content which I have posted.

Nothing about it is luxury...amendment VIII of the US constitution protects as a basic right against public humiliation as punishment of a crime and for good reason...it sets a bad precedent.

And this is in fact about the signs...

http://xenforo.com/community/threads/sex-offender-signs-publicly-identify-convicted-predators-in-florida.50621


and if you look at what a registered sex offender must do, the signs in comparison really have no benefit to anyone...it is a feel good law meant to shut people up and in reality it will do nothing but make more problems of a different kind.


To me all they symbolize is illegal procedure in direct violation of one of the main principles of the constitution and no state Florida included can just ignore parts of the major document which grants the basic things you can count on in this country and sets the framework for constructing law.



you should really look at the link in this quote...sex offenders are not all en masse getting away scott-free as you put it and there is a quite the list of things a sexual offender must comply with after being released from jail...

And yes, I do not want to see signs all over the place talking about sex offenders, no more than I want to be around people who are actually sexual predators.

I agree with your sentiment that if a lunatic runs around raping kids or subdued or helpless people that they should get some form of the bobbit, but you are way out of line in saying that everyone who thinks that violating constitutional law is not OK is protecting sex offenders.

I am on the side of the people and the laws that protect them, breaking laws to enforce other laws and breaking laws in sentencing are a scary incremental step into taking away freedoms and general corruption and oppression.




Everything I posted I believe to be fact and if you don't understand them you shouldn't involve yourself with them while accusing others of supporting sexual offenders because if you look at it from my perspective...

you are posting 'a public sign' yourself stating that I am in support of something that is shameful and completely untrue in vengeance for me not agreeing with you...quaint.

No, posting public signs won't get out of control at all:rolleyes: .

We are at both at the opposite sides of the spectrum on this and that is where I will leave it. You made your feelings quite clear (some i don't agree with) but it's your right to express them.
 
You realize as a convicted felon, you lose some of your constitutional rights?
That does not include ignoring an Amendment which clearly makes posting a permanent sign illegal.

It is illegal to beat someone down....does that mean if that someone is convicted of assault and battery and serves their time, it is ok and legal to whoop that ass when they get out of jail?
 
That does not include ignoring an Amendment which clearly makes posting a permanent sign illegal.

It is illegal to beat someone down....does that mean if that someone is convicted of assault and battery and serves their time, it is ok and legal to whoop that ass when they get out of jail?

That has no bearing on what I said, and your comparison is moot.
 
That has no bearing on what I said, and your comparison is moot.
First of all if you are going to address and argue with me and not the point...add a 'WHY' in the summation of your words please, describe for me please why it is moot and why it has no bearing...otherwise you are trying to fight me and not the issue at hand here.

So like I said, how so?

You can't beat an ex con for being an ex con as punishment because it is against the law to sanction violence as a punishment, for the same reason and under the very same principles, you cant violate an amendment in order to serve out a sentence.
 
As I said, that comparison you made isn't close to the issue we are all discussing. Apples/Oranges.

I'm not trying to "fight you", as you like to put it. If you want a fight, look elsewhere.
 
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