Court case against my hackers.

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MGSteve said:
Well, there is obviously enough proof that the police were interested and appear, as Slavik suggests, that they will be taking action. I can't understand your comments of arrogance though, from what I've read, he knows its them and almost certainly has proof, but he's hardly going to post it on a public forum when its now a police matter, is he?

As for the 20 years, I suspect that's what they would be facing as a maximum punishment under the computer misuse act. Its not to say they would get that, but that's what the maximum could be.
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Well, if there is enough proof then that is quite another matter. But when Slavic was asked here how he knew that it was the same guys who attacked his forum, he said only that they posted about it in their forum and that is how he knew it was them. He did not say of having other proof. I do not mean that he should post here what that proof is as that would be unwise but to have mentioned it that he had solid proof other than the heresay. Hence my comments above.

Anyway, as I said above, this whole story seemes quite off to me. Because the investigation alone would take months to be completed and then for the case to go before a judge. And yet, he did everything in a matter of days. That seems totally a cock and bull story to me. Not to mention that there are always 2 sides to a story. But it seems like everyone is believing Slavic 's version. And don''t anyone dare to say anything otherwise :D

About the arrogance, it is all over his posts/replies.
 
borbole said:
Because the investigation alone would take months to be completed and then for the case to go before a judge.


About the arrogance, it is all over his posts/replies.
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1) You once again jump to conclusions which I have never stated. I have stated it is now an "active police matter". Does this means they have been arrested? No. Does it mean they have been sentenced? No. It means the police are taking an active interest in the case.

2) You mistake my "arrogance" for factually correct and well informed posts, everything posted in this thread has been done often with many hours of background research and evidence backing it up, so obviously i'm not going to suffer someone who thinks they know better when by their own admission, they don't know how the legal system works over here.

borbole said:
Not to mention that there are always 2 sides to a story. But it seems like everyone is believing Slavic 's version. And don''t anyone dare to say anything otherwise :D
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Do you think I would willing inform people and take legal proceedings costing hundreds of pounds based on stuff I made up?...
 
borbole said:
Because the investigation alone would take months to be completed and then for the case to go before a judge. And yet, he did everything in a matter of days.
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AAhh, well that's easy enough to explain, our civil justice system is actually reasonably efficient and cases can get heard pretty quickly, unlike cases in the US it appears, judging by the one XF are defending and other personal experience of the US legal system.

btw, for clarity, I'm talking about the case Slavik successfully bought against them a few weeks ago, not the recent events, which naturally, haven't made it to court yet. We may be quick, but we're not 1940s Germany.

Although I'm sure some would beg to differ! lol
 
What surprises me about this thread. I'm no legal expert, but would have thought talking about it in public here Slavik the way you have. Well, your leaving yourself wide open to get the case kicked out of court. I know if I was them, I'd be pointing a judge and jury to this thread and how you've covered it from day one labelling them guilty - before they was even found guilty. I'd be asking for it to be kicked out of court.

Not taking sides here or anything, but I don't think this thread should have been started in the first place. It was something private and personal between you and them really. Instead it's been glorified into a 10 page long novel. I just don't get what your purpose is with it?
 
MGSteve said:
AAhh, well that's easy enough to explain, our civil justice system is actually reasonably efficient and cases can get heard pretty quickly, unlike cases in the US it appears, judging by the one XF are defending and other personal experience of the US legal system.

btw, for clarity, I'm talking about the case Slavik successfully bought against them a few weeks ago, not the recent events, which naturally, haven't made it to court yet. We may be quick, but we're not 1940s Germany.

Although I'm sure some would beg to differ! lol
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Criminal technology cases can take longer if there is no admittance of guilt. You would be surprised at how slow the court can be in processing these cases mainly due to the fact that computer equipment usually has to be seized and forensic examination needs to take place. Forensic examination can sometimes take up to 1-2 years if your lucky (which has happened many times with child pornography cases, even very recently).

As for this discussion, I think the best outcome you could get here is a court injunction telling them to stop. I don't know the specifics but I wouldn't be too sure that this will get to a criminal court as it doesn't seem serious enough to prosecute. If it does, I'd be surprised if they get anything more than a fine based on seriousness of the offence.
 
Same here, I'm from the UK and very much doubt they'll get thrown in prison for this. Prisons are overcrowded as it is, it's just not a serious enough crime to warrant it today unless your talking about some government site getting hacked or something daft like that. But not somebodies hobby forum!

Also, as for longer prison sentences mentioned previously. This would have to be referred to Crown Court to do that anyway. This has gone through the "Small Claims" court from what I can gather. If that's true, I don't think they can hand down prison sentences, only issue fines. It would need to be at least a Magistrates Court to give a small prison sentence, before then having to be referred to Crown Court for any higher sentencing.

If this is going through "Small Claims", I haven't read the whole thread to be honest. The best you can really hope for is large fines dished out as compensation, but even then there's a limit with small claims (hence the name "Small Claims"). It used to be something like a £1000 maximum fine could be issued many years ago, no doubt that's changed higher now.

Also, this is a Civil case, not a Criminal Case brought forward by the police.
 
mrGTB said:
What surprises me about this thread. I'm no legal expert, but would have thought talking about it in public here Slavik the way you have. Well, your leaving yourself wide open to get the case kicked out of court. I know if I was them, I'd be pointing a judge and jury to this thread and how you've covered it from day one labelling them guilty - before they was even found guilty. I'd be asking for it to be kicked out of court.

Not taking sides here or anything, but I don't think this thread should have been started in the first place. It was something private and personal between you and them really. Instead it's been glorified into a 10 page long novel. I just don't get what your purpose is with it?
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Question. Has Slavik stated the names of the party who is involved?
 
mrGTB said:
Same here, I'm from the UK and very much doubt they'll get thrown in prison for this. Prisons are overcrowded as it is, it's just not a serious enough crime to warrant it today unless your talking about some government site getting hacked or something daft like that. But not somebodies hobby forum!

Also, as for longer prison sentences mentioned previously. This would have to be referred to Crown Court to do that anyway. This has gone through the "Small Claims" court from what I can gather. If that's true, I don't think they can hand down prison sentences, only issue fines. It would need to be at least a Magistrates Court to give a small prison sentence, before then having to be referred to Crown Court for any higher sentencing.

If this is going through "Small Claims", I haven't read the whole thread to be honest. The best you can really hope for is large fines dished out as compensation, but even then there's a limit with small claims (hence the name "Small Claims"). It used to be something like a £1000 maximum fine could be issued many years ago, no doubt that's changed higher now.
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The small claims court is technically not a "court" and it only deals with civil cases anyway, which have already been dealt with in this case.

What's currently being talked about here, hasn't been put through any court yet. A statement was only taken by police, apparently.
 
Well that was my thinking. That it could not go to Magistrates or Crown court based on being a Civil case for prison sentencing. Unless the police get involved and bring Criminal charges forward, then that's different. But anyway, enough from me on this. I doubt they'll see the inside of a jail cell for hacking a forum board.
 
mrGTB said:
Well that was my thinking. That it could not go to Magistrates or Crown court based on being a Civil case for prison sentencing. Unless the police get involved and bring Criminal charges forward, then that's different. But anyway, enough from me on this. I doubt they'll see the inside of a jail cell for hacking a forum board.
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You cannot go to prison in civil cases. You can only be fined or ordered to pay compensation.
 
Pereira said:
You cannot go to prison in civil cases. You can only be fined or ordered to pay compensation.
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Yes, I know. That's what I meant. Hence why you can't be dealt with by a the Criminal Magistrates or Crown court, or given prison sentencing only they can hand out.
 
Pereira said:
What's currently being talked about here, hasn't been put through any court yet. A statement was only taken by police, apparently.
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But you said they wasn't even charged yet, so which is it? Your jumping the gun a bit here. Look up! :rolleyes:
 
mrGTB said:
But you said they wasn't even charged yet, so which is it? Your jumping the gun a bit here, the police haven't charged them yet. :rolleyes:
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Nope. I said they are pursuing legal action, as in they are looking to charge them with a criminal offence. I never said that anyone was charged. For someone to be charged and prosecuted with a criminal offence, they need to go through a criminal case, not civil as you said below:
That it could not go to Magistrates or Crown court based on being a Civil case for prison sentencing.
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Pereira said:
Nope. I said they are pursuing legal action
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Same thing no matter how you choose to reword it. They've not yet been charged with anything by the police, your own words. And who's to say they ever will or won't be? Your going around in circles here and there's no point talking any further about it. Just because they are pursuing legal action, doesn't mean that will be the final outcome.

If you study law, then you should know that much at least!
 
I really don't get what I've said wrong here but clearly there must have been some miscommunication.

I'l PM you instead. :)

EDIT: I can't PM you because I can't view your profile or something but to summarise:

The person here is seeking criminal charges against the "hackers" and as such this means it requires a criminal case, not civil. By calling it a criminal case doesn't mean any criminality has taken place. A criminal case is pursued in the courts and criminality is usually determined by a jury.

As I said, I really don't understand what I've said wrong here but feel free to PM me a reply or let me reply back to you after your next reply. ;)
 
ummm...well, I missed a bunch of the posts and have been catching up. My first reaction is that there is a lot of misunderstandings about the legal system.

This issue of hearsay...well, the statement on the website would not be hearsay. Hearsay is an out of court statement, offered for the truth of the matter asserted. Long standing common law exceptions to the hearsay rule are "admissions" (i.e., the statement is something admitting to a fact in dispute), statements of party-opponents that are adverse to the person making the statement, and, finally, the statement on the website would likely be admissible not for the truth of the matter (i.e., taking it outside of the definition of hearsay), but rather to show intent, motive, common plan, etc. (These are codified in the US in the Rules of Federal Evidence, and in the UK, can be found in the Criminal Justice Act of 2003).

The statement, along with the previous conviction/finding of civil liability, would certainly meet the threshold of probable cause to arrest. It would also support issuance of a warrant. However, the police could also take a preliminary step and issue a subpoena to the ISP to get further evidence.

The case as stated seems quite strong. Of course, the process has to run its course, but given that they have been found culpable for previous similar acts against the same victim, seems like the great likelihood is that the perpetrators will be convicted (either on the evidence or via a guilty plea).

Don't see much here to criticize Slavik on. Hope it all goes well!
 
Oh, and generally, yes, civil cases do not result in confinement. However, there is criminal contempt of a civil court. This can result in jail time.
 
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