August Update discussion thread.

[Astrum]

Hahaha..funny how the truth never comes out until they shut the door in your face at the last minute, no warning no nothing. Now lets look back at this year, were at month 9 and have only have 1-3 updates if u can call them that. And the thing is they say the same thing, we will let u know more at a later time, well how later and what time? when you say we will no longer be supporting this, leaving us all hanging?

Heres my problem, your trying to keep all of us customers hanging on but for what? You have given us nothing to go on. We dont even know if XF will even be around in a few months much less for years. I have been in this business since 1996. I know how something like this should be handled, and having been sued before i know how that goes too. But keeping quiet is not the right answer. Im not being negative or bashing KAM( if thats even accurate lol) at all.

Just highly annoyed that we know nothing! BTW i do know a little bit of the truth however i will not say because i do not want to be banned, seems at times like these when people start spilling the beans, posts get deleted and users get banned so with all of that said....

Not holding my breath..take that how u want.

So you go to a realtor and say you really want to buy some house they're selling. It's beautiful, just what you're looking for. The realtor mentions there's a forest fire a mile away currently consuming homes. You say you don't care, you just have to have that house, it's amazing! You move in and the next day the forest fire spreads and your brand new home catches on fire. Rather than saying, "oh man, why did I take such a risky gamble on this home?" you call the realtor and start complaining that your brand new home is one fire.

I've said it before, but if your livelihood depends on running a forum or forums, you should have done a lot more research. I'm not trying to be a ****, but the lawsuit was announced before XenForo 1.0 came out (a week I believe). It wasn't some small claims court issue either, it was a multi-million dollar company filing two lawsuits in two different countries against a start-up and its founders. Would I like more information? Yes. Do I honestly expect very detailed information, roadmaps, rumor debunking, etc...? No. This lawsuit is probably a living hell for KAM. It's also pretty clear that this is an attempt to destroy XenForo through litigation. So there's that, plus personal issues which I won't even guess at since it's frankly none of my business and is extremely arrogant and rude to do so.

This whole ordeal doesn't negate the fact that XenForo is perfectly useable right now - though there is the spam issue and a potential legal issue down the road. If it doesn't have the features you need then you should have went with another forum package that does. Especially considering the lawsuits which, as I stated previously, is a huge deal and should be heavily considered. Yeah it sucks that a lot of you probably want to support XenForo and this is making it hard, but at the end of the day you are accountable for deciding which forum package to use and all of the problems associated with it, not XenForo. If you can support XenForo and get by without harming your own livelihood then great, if not then it's probably time to move on. You bought a license to a product that makes no guarantee of future releases - although they have stated security fixes will be distributed promptly. If you have a XenForo license currently your options are to switch to a different forum, or hold out through the litigious storm.

As always, best of luck to KAM and XenForo, I really hope you guys pull through.

 

[BGL]

this thread has evolved and grown on me and it is comparable to my affinity for bacon...

Actually that's spam you are in love with.

 

[Floren]

The intention of this thread and announcement was very good, but again, some people just destroyed it.

Maybe you can help us understand what was the intention of the announcement. Personally, I understand nothing. To me, the announcement is just a hocus-pocus with nothing informative to concerned customers. Please enlighten us.

 

[Floren]

Ashley's announcement was notably lacking in the way of forward progress and look at the response.

In short, Ashley's announcement is useless to me as I'm interested on XenForo product not the devs personal life. I don't know why others say is informative and with good intentions. So far, we are informed that the devs are out and they don't know when they will get back to work. Great news, right? I have no idea where are the good intentions others talk about it.

 

[EQnoble]

Actually that's spam you are in love with.

no it's clearly bacon...but thanks for telling me what I love ...I don't know where I would be without you.

 

[Jeremy P]

Maybe you can help us understand what was the intention of the announcement.

Well it's my understanding that in the beginning they were accepting questions to be answered shortly.

In short, Ashley's announcement is useless to me as I'm interested on XenForo product not the devs personal life. I don't know why others say is informative and with good intentions. So far, we are informed that the devs are out and they don't know when they will get back to work. Great news, right? I have no idea where are the good intentions others talk about it.

I think they should be more transparent, but to me, this is fair. People seriously invested in the project should have researched and understood the potential reaches of the lawsuit. I didn't exactly see this coming but I understood it was a possibility. I don't buy into much of the speculation, but I am willing to accept that some things people are saying may be true, but to me nothing unreasonable has transpired. I don't know what people in this community are getting all riled up about.

I hope to see the lawsuits dismissed and personal affairs handled, but I accept that that is not a guarantee. If it fails it's gonna fail. You can jump ship now but it's not sinking just yet.

 

[whynot]

You can jump ship now but it's not sinking just yet.

No,it's not sinking.
Ships can operate without staff,can't they?

 

[Jeremy P]

No,it's not sinking.
Ships can operate without staff,can't they?

Without staff we're sure not getting back to shore, so I see your point, but I'm fine with cruising for a while to see if they come back soon.

If you're not, fine, but you should have known it could happen and are free to move on to something else.

All I'm saying is there is a chance this isn't going to be the worst case scenario everyone loves to scream about.. and that as it is, it's unfavorable but not unreasonable. S* happens.

 

[Vicros]

So you go to a realtor and say you really want to buy some house they're selling. It's beautiful, just what you're looking for. The realtor mentions there's a forest fire a mile away currently consuming homes. You say you don't care, you just have to have that house, it's amazing! You move in and the next day the forest fire spreads and your brand new home catches on fire. Rather than saying, "oh man, why did I take such a risky gamble on this home?" you call the realtor and start complaining that your brand new home is one fire.

I've said it before, but if your livelihood depends on running a forum or forums, you should have done a lot more research. I'm not trying to be a ****, but the lawsuit was announced before XenForo 1.0 came out (a week I believe). It wasn't some small claims court issue either, it was a multi-million dollar company filing two lawsuits in two different countries against a start-up and its founders. Would I like more information? Yes. Do I honestly expect very detailed information, roadmaps, rumor debunking, etc...? No. This lawsuit is probably a living hell for KAM. It's also pretty clear that this is an attempt to destroy XenForo through litigation. So there's that, plus personal issues which I won't even guess at since it's frankly none of my business and is extremely arrogant and rude to do so.

This whole ordeal doesn't negate the fact that XenForo is perfectly useable right now - though there is the spam issue and a potential legal issue down the road. If it doesn't have the features you need then you should have went with another forum package that does. Especially considering the lawsuits which, as I stated previously, is a huge deal and should be heavily considered. Yeah it sucks that a lot of you probably want to support XenForo and this is making it hard, but at the end of the day you are accountable for deciding which forum package to use and all of the problems associated with it, not XenForo. If you can support XenForo and get by without harming your own livelihood then great, if not then it's probably time to move on. You bought a license to a product that makes no guarantee of future releases - although they have stated security fixes will be distributed promptly. If you have a XenForo license currently your options are to switch to a different forum, or hold out through the litigious storm.

As always, best of luck to KAM and XenForo, I really hope you guys pull through.

You realize im not talking about the lawsuit that was going to happen even before the beta, which i had a license before the beta was even out. I was aware of that. I know what the lawsuit is doing, were talking about what KAM is not doing. They are not informing us of anything..at all. Thats the problem, thats what everyone is upset about. If you dont know the future of XF then just freaking say it, dont lie or with hold information from ur customers. People say no news is good news, well not in this situation. No news is bad news and not acceptable..for some. Not really me as I have an active license for IPB ( which i have had for 6 years ), and vB ( which i have had for 6 years and am on the aplha/beta test team ). The future of XF has no merit on me or my livelihood, i prefer wordpress for that lol. The problem here lies on the fact that the truth is out there and some know it but you cant say it, because its some big secret lol. Sillyness..or as i prefer to call it shenanigans. XF is a very nice software..but THIS SHIP WILL NOT OPERATE ITSELF. The owners have been away for the better half of a year and looks whats happened..customers are jumping ship. Not because KAM are being sued, but because they do not inform them of anything.

 

[Jeremy P]

That's fine, but I'm sure KAM have seen the complaints and made their decision on how to deal with it. It's acceptable for me - I'd like more communication but if they don't want to say anything that's their right.

If the real issue you are having here is bad communication (which is reasonable), I think you've got your answer. You're free to go if they are not handling the communication problem in the way you want. I understand the desire to place some pressure on them for answers but people around here are going about it the wrong way and making this community look just as bad as the development slump.

 

[Blue]

You guys are harshing my mellow.

 

[Jake Bunce]

You guys are harshing my mellow.

Reminds of South Park

Think of a cloud...

 

[Mark.B]

What if legal counsel recommendeds they stay off any "public" communication means until the case is over?

1. No legal advisor would EVER advise you to abandon your business because of a lawsuit from a competitor.
2. Brogan has stated; "There is no such order stopping the owners talking about the state of the business or development. Yet another stupid rumour conjured up to explain away events."

However despite this people still persist with the ludicrous concept that the three owners of the business have completely abandoned it on legal advice/instruction.

 

[ManagerJosh]

1. No legal advisor would EVER advise you to abandon your business because of a lawsuit from a competitor.
2. Brogan has stated; "There is no such order stopping the owners talking about the state of the business or development. Yet another stupid rumour conjured up to explain away events."

However despite this people still persist with the ludicrous concept that the three owners of the business have completely abandoned it for legal advice/instruction.

I never stated anything about abandoning businesses. What I suggested was that legal counsel recommended that Kier, and Mike refrain from "public" communications until the case is over.

 

[Mark.B]

I never stated anything about abandoning businesses. What I suggested was that legal counsel recommended that Kier, and Mike refrain from "public" communications until the case is over.

That is abandoning your business. No lawyer would ever recommend you do that, not even if they thought you'd lose the case.

In any case Brogan's confirmed that's not the case. So, we know their silence is BY CHOICE which is what makes it so contemptuous.

 

[Astrum]

I know what the lawsuit is doing, were talking about what KAM is not doing. They are not informing us of anything..at all. Thats the problem, thats what everyone is upset about. If you dont know the future of XF then just freaking say it, dont lie or with hold information from ur customers. People say no news is good news, well not in this situation. No news is bad news and not acceptable..for some.

Previously we posted about XenForo 1.2 being delayed without an estimated release date. Unfortunately, there is no update on this matter and we are unsure of when we will be able to provide more information on XenForo 1.2.

Seems like all the information you need is right there. XenForo 1.2 isn't going to be released in the foreseeable future and that's all they know. Sure it doesn't go into specifics like the office is currently under biohazard quarantine and they have no access to their workstations, or KAM joined the circus and they are currently on tour around Europe performing an amazing chainsaw juggling act, but the message is pretty clear. Details aren't really needed. People keep asking "why, why, why" and when the answer is the lawsuit or personal issues there's just more people asking "why, why, why". Do you really need to keep digging when the answer to one of the big questions has already been answered? The other two big questions are "will XenForo win the lawsuit", which I doubt they know since they haven't gone to trial yet, and "is XenForo Ltd. going to go under due to the legal and financial pressures brought on by the lawsuit", which they may not know although I'm sure it's a damn big concern.

The only really bad part about their lack of interaction with the community is the rumor mill that has popped up to fill the void. I can only blame KAM so much though since while they created a perfect environment for wild speculation, other people still have to speculate rather than leaving things well enough alone. I'm sure if XenForo goes under we'll get at least part of the juicy insider story at some future date, otherwise they'll be playing PR catch-up. Either way the information we have right now is quite honestly sufficient for anyone thinking about using XenForo or is currently deciding whether or not to keep using XenForo. If it meets your requirements as is or works as is, give it a shot or keep using it if you think the potential legal ramifications down the line are acceptable. Otherwise don't use it. As much as I want to see XenForo succeed, this is the reality of the situation.

 

[Jake Bunce]

That is abandoning your business. No lawyer would ever recommend you do that, not even if they thought you'd lose the case.

In any case Brogan's confirmed that's not the case. So, we know their silence is BY CHOICE which is what makes it so contemptuous.

Can I help you?

 

[Mark.B]

Can I help you?

Jake please don't pretend the issue isn't there like so many others are doing. I have no quibble with you at all.

 

[Jake Bunce]

Jake please don't pretend the issue isn't there like so many others are doing. I have no quibble with you at all.

You say we treat you with contempt so obviously I want to make right. So how can I help you?

Or would you just like to argue? I can do that too if you want.

 

[Mark.B]

You say we treat you with contempt so obviously I want to make right. So how can I help you?

Or would you just like to argue? I can do that too if you want.

Jake with respect that's entirely missing the point and you know it.

No I don't just want to argue. You do a fine job on support, but that is not and never has been the issue. So let's leave it at that since we're never going to agree on this.