XF: take more control of Resources

[dawg]

In general they can be summed up with - "tldr; I want free add-ons."


You may find that becoming more prevalent now that @Chris D has released XPM.
I for one will be using it on my own support site for any future add-ons as it makes life a lot easier and allows for management of upgrades, renewals, etc.

That's the funny thing about this, most of the good add ons are free

Oh, i understand that programmers need support forums and it is much easier for them to support their product. If the add on is killer and a must have i will give in and join "Sports Book" for example was a must have for me so i joined their forums. It's just a personal thing Brogan, i find it highly annoying to be forced to join yet another forum. You know how many forums i am a member of now?

 

[Paul B]

I agree it's not ideal, but as @Daniel Hood said, there is no payment processing in the RM so there is no way of managing a paid add-on.
I do all of mine manually and it is a massive pain and waste of my time.

Anything which can automate that is a benefit to both developers and customers.

 

[Russ]

Personally even if XF had the option to handle payments I would still opt for using our own dedicated site. We're put in full controls of things and can setup permissions, support tickets optional resources strictly viewable by our customers, it just works better.

As Brogan mentioned the new Product Manager by @Chris D works amazing and handles our setup perfectly.

 

[dawg]

I agree it's not ideal, but as @Daniel Hood said, there is no payment processing in the RM so there is no way of managing a paid add-on.
I do all of mine manually and it is a massive pain and waste of my time.

Anything which can automate that is a benefit to both developers and customers.

Bottom line. Xenforo is superior, the resources are superior, and the support is superior. There is no comparison between Xenforo and VB any longer, VB is dead, to me at least. I cant believe after the colossal failure that VB suffered that their are people still willing to compare the two products. lol

 

[dawg]

Personally even if XF had the option to handle payments I would still opt for using our own dedicated site. We're put in full controls of things and can setup permissions, support tickets optional resources strictly viewable by our customers, it just works better.

As Brogan mentioned the new Product Manager by @Chris D works amazing and handles our setup perfectly.

I joined Russ's forum because his products kick major hiney

 

[Ridemonkey]

I'd actually far rather join a forum than have an attachment emailed to me. I get enough freakin' emails as it is

 

[Shelley]

Personally even if XF had the option to handle payments I would still opt for using our own dedicated site. We're put in full controls of things and can setup permissions, support tickets optional resources strictly viewable by our customers, it just works better.

As Brogan mentioned the new Product Manager by @Chris D works amazing and handles our setup perfectly.

I expect you, no wait, DEMAND, DEMAND I SAY for you to release it for free. Heck, I want you to pay me to use your payment processing/ ticket add-on. #DEMAND #blood #bbsmileyceo

 

[Chris D]

In defence of "making" people sign up for their personal sites, you've got to think about it for a moment. It's so necessary.

How is any one person able to keep track of this in a single thread at XenForo.com?



That's nearly 900 threads containing nearly 4,400 messages.

As much as you may not like it, registering at a separate site is essential.

 

[John L.]

In defence of "making" people sign up for their personal sites, you've got to think about it for a moment. It's so necessary.

How is any one person able to keep track of this in a single thread at XenForo.com?

View attachment 85678

That's nearly 900 threads containing nearly 4,400 messages.

As much as you may not like it, registering at a separate site is essential.

Woah, I just use excel spreadsheets lol

 

[TimeWizardCosmo]

I don't mind paying 5 bucks for an addon that took someone 30 minutes to make. That's 30 minutes of my time not spent slitting my wrists trying to figure it out myself.

I do get a little annoyed with the desire to cram a copyright notice into my footer for every single addon I've ever installed, especially when the styling doesn't match how xenForo does it and it all ends up looking like ****. I've uninstalled plenty of addons because of that.

The way @Chris D , @Bob B, @Daniel Hood and @Waindigo sell/maintain/code/everything their addons is perfect though.

 

[Liam W]

I still don't know how much to charge for my addons, but I find it nescesarry to do so. However, I feel that the ratio of my paid to free addons is fair...

As for my site... It's easier than doing it manually or using an external service. Also, if I upload them to my site I can get better stats.

So, yeah.

Liam

 

[ibrian]

I don't get these threads.

In general they can be summed up with - "tldr; I want free add-ons."

No, it's called not wanting to feel exploited.

Places such as vbulletin.org and Wordpress encouraged a sense of community - that everyone was chipping for the greater good of the community software.

There are some great modders here at the xenforo community who clearly have that same ideal.

But there are others who exist here only to serve their own business purposes, and are happy to exploit this community. That's not welcome.

Having free mods no longer supported is one thing - paying for mods that stop being supported is just plain annoying.

Even worse is the number of mods here that require an initial purpose, yearly subscription, and/or try and force links to their own websites on the user.

Need I remind anyone that after I started this thread, one major plugin developer was banned from the forums after it turned out they were actually logging user server information?

I appreciate that xenforo has come a long way, and there are areas that could still be improved upon.

But here's a suggestion - only list freely available mods, that demand nothing for their use, on xenforo.org. Let everyone else keep their own on their own websites, and not have them advertised or linked to on xenforo.org, except through their signature links.

Does that really sound such a terrible thing? And just maybe it would help push out some of the leeches, while better helping to foster a sense of community.

2c.

 

[wang]

No, it's called not wanting to feel exploited.

But there are others who exist here only to serve their own business purposes, and are happy to exploit this community. That's not welcome.

Exploiting? Please explain how it is exploiting when one is selling his work, be that add ons or styles? I am very curious to your definition of the word exploit.

As far as I have seen here, the developers and designers are trying to make a honest buck with their skills. What is wrong with that? If you want free stuff, then I think that you should go to Smf, Mybb or whatever free forum software. Wait, I have seen people selling add ons and styles there too.

Your post leaves me speechless. If you are so torn up about people that are 'exploiting' here, then why do not you start to learn coding and release all your work for free here. Do that and then come back and we will talk again.

P.s. Can I ask what you are doing for living? At your job, are you working for a paycheck, or are you working for free. Because, if you charge for your time and get a paycheck, then you are exploiting, by your logic that is.

 

[Digital Doctor]

Places such as vbulletin.org

vBorg is dead.
vB5 killed it.

XF addons are a lot of work to make and if no one gets paid everyone suffers

 

[Robust]

So you want add-on developers who put in an unknown amount of time to you to sell for $5 because you consider it a minor modification?

Nobody forces you to buy it. The RM is just a listing of resources. If you want it, pay the desired price or don't get it. It may sound rude, but you can't force price limits based on how many lines of code an add-on has...

Also, you can't even claim market manipulation on this because this kind of market is so diverse you can't manipulate it. Prices will always be independent until there is competition. If you're upset about prices, express it and another developer may take it up for, again, their own profit (surprise!) from people wanting sales at the cost of poorer code and/or lost features.

 

[Arty]

If you want everything for free, you are on wrong website. XenForo is commercial software.

There are plenty of free alternatives available. However you'll immediately notice massive drop in quality of everything: styles, add-ons, sometimes even support. Why? There are multiple reasons:

1. Many developers are using free platforms to learn how to code before starting using their skills to make money. Very few developers are doing it because they love free software.

2. Development takes time. Developing, fixing bugs, maintaining, providing support - it all takes time. Would a skilled developer rather get paid for his time or work for free? Unless worldwide communism suddenly happened and everyone wasn't told about it, not many people are willing to work on stuff for free.

So there you have it. Most of good quality stuff for commercial software is not free (with few exceptions).

 

[Brad Padgett]

I don't mind paying 5 bucks for an addon that took someone 30 minutes to make. That's 30 minutes of my time not spent slitting my wrists trying to figure it out myself.

I do get a little annoyed with the desire to cram a copyright notice into my footer for every single addon I've ever installed, especially when the styling doesn't match how xenForo does it and it all ends up looking like ****. I've uninstalled plenty of addons because of that.

The way @Chris D , @Bob B, @Daniel Hood and @Waindigo sell/maintain/code/everything their addons is perfect though.

You make a valid point. I have personally noticed that many of the free add-ons that say they have branding actually don't. I use several free template hacks such as All Rich Usernames and Last Post Avatar and they didn't have branding. Others such as simple refer did. However, in the midst of free software I appreciate it just as much as the next guy as you are right, to pay a little here and there for something actually useful that cost a small amount and actually saves you time and is worth it.

 

[ibrian]

I think people misunderstand my argument - it's not about wanting things for free, it's about xenforo taking more control and responsibility for the various addons. I was repeatedly burned with purchases when I first joined, and it didn't give a good impression. I'm talking about a few hundred dollars, not pennies, here.

I repeat the point that there are great developers who provide free or charged-for addons. But there are bad apples who only have their own short-term business interests at heart.

The argument about free or not is really a separate issue - I think some people forget that community building is overwhelmingly volunteer-driven. I doubt many people here are earning a living wage from their forums, nor paying their moderators a salary.

Some developers are more interested in building communities. Some think filling their pockets is more important, regardless on how that reflects on the xf community.

And that's why I suggested it would be in the xf staff's interest to ensure third-party development were held to greater account - certainly than when I first joined.

Simply providing feedback.

 

[Alpha1]

What xenforo is missing is a good reputation system for developers and clients as well as a good rating/review system for resources and a bug/suggestions listing for resources.
It is simply invisible who delivers quality or who delivers at all.
High/Low quality developers go unrecognized as there is no way to rate code quality, superb support, no list of outstanding bugs, or implemented/outstanding suggestions.
Problems stay under the radar and problematic developers and clients can repeatedly pose the same problems.

 

[The Sandman]

What xenforo is missing is a good reputation system for developers and clients as well as a good rating/review system for resources and a bug/suggestions listing for resources.
It is simply invisible who delivers quality or who delivers at all.
High/Low quality developers go unrecognized as there is no way to rate code quality, superb support, no list of outstanding bugs, or implemented/outstanding suggestions.
Problems stay under the radar and problematic developers and clients can repeatedly pose the same problems.

This, and the relatively slow pace at which XF adds minor features let alone major ones, making us dependent on 3rd party add-ons to get the functionality we want/need.