Why is XenForo so expensive

[Serpius]

I thought that MyBB is better in security. It runs rock-solid and provides vB3-like experience.

I ran MyBB for about 4 years before switching to Xenforo.

There are many reasons why I switched to Xenforo, but I will give you 3 good reasons.

1. Xenforo does a far better job in taking in videos and other media. MyBB struggles with this. It can be done with a lot of coding, which I do not do. Just paste the URL of the video or media and it's already posted and ready to be seen by users. It's a bit more complex in MyBB.
2. Regular updates/upgrades on Xenforo are far more superior than updates/upgrades of MyBB. There are have been numerous times that the MyBB updates/upgrade actually corrupted certain sections of the admin's websites and you can see immediately that admins flood MyBB.com with complaints of broken websites. This actually happened to my website one time. Luckily for me, I had a previous day's backup and installed the previous working version of MyBB and restored the previous day's backup.
3. Installing add-ons and styles is far superior on Xenforo over MyBB. So much cleaner and faster to install add-ons and styles on Xenforo over MyBB.

I can list many more reasons, but those are the ones that are important to me.

 

[Serpius]

I've wondered for a European based company like Xenforo, why do they use the U.S currency?

Regardless if the pricing was done in British pounds, in Euros, Canadian Dollars, if I had to purchase Xenforo in one of those currencies, it's just a matter of currency conversion to make the transaction happen. I'm a US citizen.

At today's currency rates (September 8, 2011)

135.39 Euros = $160 USD
203.20 CAD = $160 USD
116.25 British Pounds = $160 USD

So... bottom line... it really doesn't matter if Xenforo is based in Europe, currency conversions are easily done by payment processors such as Paypal.

 

[FTL]

If you are going to compare the two, do it correctly.
Forum to forum.
The $600 figure you quote entails a LOT more than the simple forum.
$100 for Forum
$100 for Commerce
$100 for Pages
$75 for Blogs
$75 for Gallery
$75 for Downloads
And Calendar is free (which XF does not have)

My renewal for Forums, Commerce and Pages is $75 for 6 months.
$25 for Forum
$35 for Commerce
$15 for Pages
Also realize that included in that renewal for IPS is spam protection with the base forum option.

If you compare Forum to Forum, my yearly renewal for it would be only $50. Last time I checked, $50 was less than $55 that XF is... and actually my current 1 year extension for XF is $85. Yes, IPS is $65 more per year, but the abilities granted by Pages alone outweighs many of the XF add-ons and Commerce integrates with my Classifieds add-on that would allow me to sell classified ads (and items) direct from IPS using a professional level classifieds add-on with billing/payment built in if I chose to sell the "ability" to place classified ads on the site.

I have done it properly. I've compared the complete package of IC with the complete package of XF and XF is much cheaper.

Unsurprisingly, there's a lot of overlap in the features and each software has its own unique features - a hypothetical blend of the two with all the best features would be epic. Of course, if you're gonna cut out modules from IC, then it gets cheaper as per your example.

And make no mistake, IC is excellent software which I might still use on another site. I still have my personal latest download of it from 2013 that I could run locally if I wanted to, with no time limit. Of course, it's way out of date now, but still nice to play with and $100 gets me the latest version, if I want, with all the modules.

 

[Serpius]

IPB is already not an option anymore since a decade ago due to its pricing policy.
If XF follows what IPB does then I am pretty sure people will vote with their footsteps.

Why can't you admit the huge financial differences among countries?

Of course, there are huge financial differences among countries.

I can say the same for huge cultural differences among countries.
I can say the same for huge language differences among countries.
I can say the same for huge religious differences among countries.

I can go on and on, but you get the idea.

The pricing of Xenforo is based on fair market value.

If you do not think it's fair, you are not required to buy it. It is that simple, not complicated.

There is other forum software that you can use for free. It's that simple, not complicated.

 

[ShikiSuen]

I ran MyBB for about 4 years before switching to Xenforo.

There are many reasons why I switched to Xenforo, but I will give you 3 good reasons.

1. Xenforo does a far better job in taking in videos and other media. MyBB struggles with this. It can be done with a lot of coding, which I do not do. Just paste the URL of the video or media and it's already posted and ready to be seen by users. It's a bit more complex in MyBB.
2. Regular updates/upgrades on Xenforo are far more superior than updates/upgrades of MyBB. There are have been numerous times that the MyBB updates/upgrade actually corrupted certain sections of the admin's websites and you can see immediately that admins flood MyBB.com with complaints of broken websites. This actually happened to my website one time. Luckily for me, I had a previous day's backup and installed the previous working version of MyBB and restored the previous day's backup.
3. Installing add-ons and styles is far superior on Xenforo over MyBB. So much cleaner and faster to install add-ons and styles on Xenforo over MyBB.

I can list many more reasons, but those are the ones that are important to me.

MyBB simply brings down a forum's experience level to the same level where vB3 is.
I was only approving its security situation.

XenForo is an OS-like platform for websites. That's what differences you enumerated are made because of.

 

[TPerry]

I have done it properly. I've compared the complete package of IC with the complete package of XF and XF is much cheaper.

Unsurprisingly, there's a lot of overlap in the features and each software has its own unique features - a hypothetical blend of the two with all the best features would be epic. Of course, if you're gonna cut out modules from IC, then it gets cheaper as per your example.

And make no mistake, IC is excellent software which I might still use on another site. I still have my personal latest download of it from 2013 that I could run locally if I wanted to, with no time limit. Of course, it's way out of date now, but still nice to play with and $100 gets me the latest version, if I want, with all the modules.

No, you did not. You claimed the price of XenForo was $160. If you are going to claim every option available then you gave a false amount.

Xenforo: $55.00
XF ES: $55.00
XF Resource Manager: $65.00
XF Gallery: $65.00

By my addition, that comes to $240.

Now, give me a default XF offered1st party program that compares to IPS Pages. There is none.
Give me a default XF offered 1st party package that compares to IPS Commerce. There is none.

If you are going to do a like to like comparison, you have to maintain equality. That would be Gallery, Files and the Forum.

In that case you have
XF:
Forum: $55.00
RM: $65.00
Gallery: $65.00
Total: $185.00
Yearly Renewal $85.00

IPS
Forum: $100
Downloads: $75.00
Gallery: $75.00
Total: $250.00
Yearly Renewal $90.00

Note, with IPS you get a customized Spam detection service that XF currently doesn't offer (you have to use StopForumSpam, DNSBL and HoneyPot - the first and the latter require API keys).
I use and have firsthand experience with both as I use each on my separate sites that I play with.
So, other than a small difference (for most people) initial cost, the renewals are close to the same, and you do get a few additional benefits with IPS that XF does not offer... a built in Calendar function and custom spam detection service. along with the ability to use one of two mapping services... Google Maps or Mapbox and direct integration with SendGrid. Latest versions of IPS no longer use Elasticsearch AFAIK but honestly I don't use (or need) it so I haven't kept up with that. I know in the older versions it was supported natively with no need of a separate add-on.

I like XF, but there are several areas that for a full package offering it has many weaknesses. I've even found that as to the Forum level itself that IPS has surpassed XenForo in many aspects with it's recent releases.
Xenforo's Gallery is heads above that offered by IPS. I don't have Downloads so I can't compare, but I do know that they will integrate directly with IPS Commerce package to allow direct billing from your site, which XF cannot do.

 

[Wanji]

No, you did not. You claimed the price of XenForo was $160. If you are going to claim every option available then you gave a false amount.

Xenforo: $55.00
XF ES: $55.00
XF Resource Manager: $65.00
XF Gallery: $65.00

By my addition, that comes to $240.

Now, give me a default XF offered1st party program that compares to IPS Pages. There is none.
Give me a default XF offered 1st party package that compares to IPS Commerce. There is none.

If you are going to do a like to like comparison, you have to maintain equality. That would be Gallery, Files and the Forum.

In that case you have
XF:
Forum: $55.00
RM: $65.00
Gallery: $65.00
Total: $185.00
Yearly Renewal $85.00

IPS
Forum: $100
Downloads: $75.00
Gallery: $75.00
Total: $250.00
Yearly Renewal $90.00

Note, with IPS you get a customized Spam detection service that XF currently doesn't offer (you have to use StopForumSpam, DNSBL and HoneyPot - the first and the latter require API keys).
I use and have firsthand experience with both as I use each on my separate sites that I play with.
So, other than a small difference (for most people) initial cost, the renewals are close to the same, and you do get a few additional benefits with IPS that XF does not offer... a built in Calendar function and custom spam detection service. along with the ability to use one of two mapping services... Google Maps or Mapbox and direct integration with SendGrid. Latest versions of IPS no longer use Elasticsearch AFAIK but honestly I don't use (or need) it so I haven't kept up with that. I know in the older versions it was supported natively with no need of a separate add-on.

I like XF, but there are several areas that for a full package offering it has many weaknesses. I've even found that as to the Forum level itself that IPS has surpassed XenForo in many aspects with it's recent releases.
Xenforo's Gallery is heads above that offered by IPS. I don't have Downloads so I can't compare, but I do know that they will integrate directly with IPS Commerce package to allow direct billing from your site, which XF cannot do.

 

[FTL]

No, you did not. You claimed the price of XenForo was $160. If you are going to claim every option available then you gave a false amount.

Xenforo: $55.00
XF ES: $55.00
XF Resource Manager: $65.00
XF Gallery: $65.00

By my addition, that comes to $240.

Now, give me a default XF offered1st party program that compares to IPS Pages. There is none.
Give me a default XF offered 1st party package that compares to IPS Commerce. There is none.

If you are going to do a like to like comparison, you have to maintain equality. That would be Gallery, Files and the Forum.

In that case you have
XF:
Forum: $55.00
RM: $65.00
Gallery: $65.00
Total: $185.00
Yearly Renewal $85.00

IPS
Forum: $100
Downloads: $75.00
Gallery: $75.00
Total: $250.00
Yearly Renewal $90.00

Note, with IPS you get a customized Spam detection service that XF currently doesn't offer (you have to use StopForumSpam, DNSBL and HoneyPot - the first and the latter require API keys).
I use and have firsthand experience with both as I use each on my separate sites that I play with.
So, other than a small difference (for most people) initial cost, the renewals are close to the same, and you do get a few additional benefits with IPS that XF does not offer... a built in Calendar function and custom spam detection service. along with the ability to use one of two mapping services... Google Maps or Mapbox and direct integration with SendGrid. Latest versions of IPS no longer use Elasticsearch AFAIK but honestly I don't use (or need) it so I haven't kept up with that. I know in the older versions it was supported natively with no need of a separate add-on.

I like XF, but there are several areas that for a full package offering it has many weaknesses. I've even found that as to the Forum level itself that IPS has surpassed XenForo in many aspects with it's recent releases.
Xenforo's Gallery is heads above that offered by IPS. I don't have Downloads so I can't compare, but I do know that they will integrate directly with IPS Commerce package to allow direct billing from your site, which XF cannot do.

Look, I get your passionate about this, but you're simply wrong, so I'm not going to concede it.

IC is sold as a series of modules which can all be bought separately, to reduce the price. Therefore, for the complete package, one must add all the modules together which comes to $600 initial cost with $100 / 6 months renewal, or $200 / 12 months for a direct comparison.

The complete package of XF is just the basic licence for $160 and $55 / 12 months renewal, much cheaper.

The three official XF add-ons one can buy are extras for XF - it's right there in the name, "add-on". The XF package is complete without them. Using your logic, I'd have to add in the cost of every third party package going to consider XF complete, which is nonsense.

Now, even if you add in the cost of those three official add-ons, XF is still a lot cheaper than IC to buy and to renew. It's just the way it is and whether IC has some killer features over XF or not isn't relevant to the discussion as it's not about justifying the price, but just how much the full product costs.

As a side note, in my opinion, again, each product has some great features over the other, hence why I said that a hypothetical combination of the two would be epic.

 

[TPerry]

Look, I get your passionate about this, but you're simply wrong, so I'm not going to concede it.

IC is sold as a series of modules which can all be bought separately, to reduce the price. Therefore, for the complete package, one must add all the modules together which comes to $600 initial cost with $100 / 6 months renewal, or $200 / 12 months for a direct comparison.

The complete package of XF is just the basic licence for $160 and $55 / 12 months renewal, much cheaper.

The three official XF add-ons one can buy are extras for XF - it's right there in the name, "add-on". The XF package is complete without them. Using your logic, I'd have to add in the cost of every third party package going to consider XF complete, which is nonsense.

Now, even if you add in the cost of those three official add-ons, XF is still a lot cheaper than IC to buy and to renew. It's just the way it is and whether IC has some killer features over XF or not isn't relevant to the discussion as it's not about justifying the price, but just how much the full product costs.

As a side note, in my opinion, again, each product has some great features over the other, hence why I said that a hypothetical combination of the two would be epic.

No, there is no "wrong" to it. Those are actual values of comparable features. Just because XF doesn't offer a fully functional suite does not mean that you have to take every available option that IPS offers. You compare like to like (which you were given direct examples and current costs of).
You are apparently under the mistaken assumption that you require the full suite of IPS 1st party apps for it to work. You are wrong. I can simply buy the Forum alone for $100 (suite core) and $100 (forum) and pay the $25 bi-annual renewal and have the same package (actually less than Xenforo 1 year support). If I purchased XenForo Forum alone and I would pay $160.00 for the forum and $55 for the annual renewal.
I did forget that IPS does charge a base Suite cost of $100 that you have to have before you can add Forums on top of it (been about 8 years since I purchased it outright), but the facts remain the same.
If you are going to say "you have to buy all the associated modules" for IPS, then you have to do the same with XenForo. The reality is that you buy what you NEED with either one. I have no use for Downloads, Blogs or Gallery on my IPS site, so I didn't have to buy them but I did need Commerce & Pages. I did have the requirement for Gallery and Resource Manager for my XF site so I had to buy them.
Initial purchase price of Forum to Forum is $40 difference and the yearly renewal for IPS is $5 cheaper than XenForo and to top it off you get Calendar free with IPS that would require an add-on with XenForo along with ability to use two different mapping providers.
As you can see, you aren't required to purchase any additional apps like Commerce, Pages, Blogs, Gallery. You can pick/choose. In fact, with IPS you don't have to have the Forums to run Gallery, Commerce, Pages, Downloads or Blogs. They will each run by themself upon the Suite Core.... unlike XF which requires the base forum (which would classify as the XF suite core) to run Gallery or Resource Manager.

Your comparison is the equivalent of saying "I can get a base Subaru WRX for $27K USD but the fully loaded Subaru WRX is going to cost me $40K USD". Neither is a fair comparison of product nor actual cost of a comparable product.

 

[Wanji]

@Tracy Perry the annual renewal for XF is now $70 instead of $55.

 

[FTL]

No, there is no "wrong" to it. Those are actual values of comparable features. Just because XF doesn't offer a fully functional suite does not mean that you have to take every available option that IPS offers. You compare like to like (which you were given direct examples and current costs of).
You are apparently under the mistaken assumption that you require the full suite of IPS 1st party apps for it to work. You are wrong. I can simply buy the Forum alone for $100 (suite core) and $100 (forum) and pay the $25 bi-annual renewal and have the same package (actually less than Xenforo 1 year support). If I purchased XenForo Forum alone and I would pay $160.00 for the forum and $55 for the annual renewal.
I did forget that IPS does charge a base Suite cost of $100 that you have to have before you can add Forums on top of it (been about 8 years since I purchased it outright), but the facts remain the same.
If you are going to say "you have to buy all the associated modules" for IPS, then you have to do the same with XenForo. The reality is that you buy what you NEED with either one. I have no use for Downloads, Blogs or Gallery on my IPS site, so I didn't have to buy them but I did need Commerce & Pages. I did have the requirement for Gallery and Resource Manager for my XF site so I had to buy them.
Initial purchase price of Forum to Forum is $40 difference and the yearly renewal for IPS is $5 cheaper than XenForo and to top it off you get Calendar free with IPS that would require an add-on with XenForo along with ability to use two different mapping providers.
As you can see, you aren't required to purchase any additional apps like Commerce, Pages, Blogs, Gallery. You can pick/choose. In fact, with IPS you don't have to have the Forums to run Gallery, Commerce, Pages, Downloads or Blogs. They will each run by themself upon the Suite Core.... unlike XF which requires the base forum (which would classify as the XF suite core) to run Gallery or Resource Manager.

View attachment 257103
Your comparison is the equivalent of saying "I can get a base Subaru WRX for $27K USD but the fully loaded Subaru WRX is going to cost me $40K USD". Neither is a fair comparison of product nor actual cost of a comparable product.

I don't know why you're trying so hard to change my mind and I really don't care. I've laid out the facts and don't want to keep going round in circles with you. You're welcome to your opinion, but don't foist it on me.

@Tracy Perry the annual renewal for XF is now $70 instead of $55.

Just checked in my account area and indeed it is. With the VAT, it comes out to $84, not especially cheap, but still less than half price compared to Invision. That $200 I quoted for IC was presumably wthout VAT, making it $240 with the VAT. That's really expensive.

 

[Wanji]

Just checked in my account area and indeed it is. With the VAT, it comes out to $84, not especially cheap, but still less than half price compared to Invision. That $200 I quoted for IC was presumably wthout VAT, making it $240 with the VAT. That's really expensive.

Perhaps the price increase is aimed at reducing customers so they can focus more on providing support.

 

[FTL]

Perhaps the price increase is aimed at reducing customers so they can focus more on providing support.

Perhaps. I'm not complaining about it, just adding to your comment.

In fact, on the pricing page, it shows $55 if taken at the same time as a main license purchase, but doesn't say what the renewal price is on its own. It should state that this is an offer price and also the full renewal price.

 

[whynot]

@Tracy Perry the annual renewal for XF is now $70 instead of $55.

Where did you see that?

 

[FTL]

Where did you see that?
View attachment 257106

You can only see it if you log into your customer account and pretend to buy it.

 

[whynot]

You can only see it if you log into your customer account and pretend to buy it.

Still $55

 

[Wanji]

Where did you see that?
View attachment 257106

As I have an official addon attached then the renewal would be $70.

 

[RobParker]

As it seems to be confiusing some people, the renewal price is higher if you have the official addons tied to the license

My renewal is $65 but I have XFES on the license too. I think (could be wrong!) it's $55 base + $10 per addon.

 

[whynot]

it's $55 base

That's it. There is no price increase.

 

[Paul B]

Renewal costs are:

• XF : $55
• XFES : $10
• XFRM : $15
• XFMG : $15