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Blatant Liars on PayPal Disputes

Liam W

Well-known member
#1
So, I've had another PayPal dispute... This time 'goods not received'.

Despite the fact I can see quite clearly in my database the exact time the add-on was downloaded...

It's been 'escalated to PayPal' now, so I'll hope for the best. It wasn't much, but all money counts.

Liam
 

Alfa1

Well-known member
#2
Was the project description clear and all agreed conditions met? i.e. were the agreed good received completely?
 

Dadparvar

Well-known member
#6
Once it happened to me too. An admin of Null site purchased and as I knew him, I reported him in Sellfy. They removed him and then he asked for refund in paypal for 2 products. (I gave enough info to paypal and they decided both of them in favor of me)
A lot before paypal, I reported him to XF staffs. I'm not sure what they did to him on xenforo.

If you have any log that shows he downloaded, and/or any conversation that shows his happiness about your add-on, then can be good clue and paypal will accept it. (IMO)
 

Snog

Well-known member
#7
Always record the date/time it was ordered, the date/time it was downloaded, the IP address it was ordered from, the IP address it was downloaded from and any other pertinent information you can think of. I've had most of my disputes settled in my favor by supplying all of that information to PayPal.

From PayPal...
If your buyer files a claim against you, PayPal may ask you to provide some of the following information:

  • A third party shipping receipt, a tracking number, or a signature confirmation to prove that an item was delivered.
  • Proof that you delivered a replacement or issued a refund if the buyer received their order, but there was a problem with it.
  • A signed contract or other proof to show that services were provided.
  • Evidence to show that the buyer downloaded your product if you sold a digital good.
The more information you provide that the product was downloaded, the better.
 

Jaxel

Well-known member
#8
I lose about $200 a week in paypal disputes... there is nothing you can do about it. Paypal ALWAYS sides with the buyer in the case of digital goods.

Even when I send Paypal logs of downloads, times, IP addresses... doesn't matter. That extra $800-1000 a month really hurts.
 

Russ

Well-known member
#10
From reading the above, it seems PayPal only cares about the buyers, not the sellers.
Not quite, if a charge back comes in as an unauthorized purchase it's very hard to dispute it. However if someone says they didn't receive the file, or it's "not as described" you have a fighting chance. The past few times paypal has actually handled it like this for me:

Dear Russ,


We’ve completed our review of this case. Due to the unique circumstances, we've decided to refund the buyer at no cost to you.


Your account won't be debited and the case has been closed.


I lose about $200 a week in paypal disputes... there is nothing you can do about it. Paypal ALWAYS sides with the buyer in the case of digital goods.

Even when I send Paypal logs of downloads, times, IP addresses... doesn't matter. That extra $800-1000 a month really hurts.

Have you tried limited purchases to verified XF users? I think switching to a simple XF board with say the product manager along with the XF verification could go quite a way for you especially if you're losing almost a $1000 a month. I don't even get that in a year
 

BirdOPrey5

Well-known member
#11
So, I've had another PayPal dispute... This time 'goods not received'.

Despite the fact I can see quite clearly in my database the exact time the add-on was downloaded...

It's been 'escalated to PayPal' now, so I'll hope for the best. It wasn't much, but all money counts.

Liam
I'd bet that your add-on recorded it as downloaded the instant the download started. Had the download not completed for any reason (downloader's battery dying, power outage, bad connection, accidentally hitting cancel, etc...) it's possible they did not receive the complete file.

Does your system allow them to download it again? Most online sellers of software make the download link active for a week or so in my experience so there is no reason the buyer can't get a copy.

If your system limits it to a single download that could be a real problem.

My answer would have been "If they didn't download it, they can go back and download it again." The fact you didn't say that concerns me you are using some kind of single download and done system.
 

Liam W

Well-known member
#12
They can download the latest version released up until their license expired. I don't restrict downloads in any way (XPM doesn't even support that).
 

Anthony Parsons

Well-known member
#14
I lose about $200 a week in paypal disputes... there is nothing you can do about it. Paypal ALWAYS sides with the buyer in the case of digital goods.
That is incorrect. I win most digital disputes for digital services, and the reason is that you need to know Paypal terms and conditions for selling them, and then ensure your terms contain the right words in which the buyer agrees. You then use those exact terms in your response to Paypal.

I have won 90% + of my chargebacks this way. Know the rules, basically, and make sure your buyer is agreeing to them.
 

Anthony Parsons

Well-known member
#18
This may help those having issues with paypal chargebacks for downloads / services / subscriptions: https://www.paypal.com/webapps/mpp/customer-concerns

Follow the info on that page and ensure you have terms that match paypal within your policies. When a chargeback occurs, ensure you can provide them with the IP of the transaction, email address of the account, so forth, as Paypal then use that data to match transaction validity. Ensure you provide evidence that they accessed the service / download, and then paypal will typically favour you. Upload everything you have to them for clear confirmation they got the service / electronic good.