Where Xenforo falls short...

DBA said:
How many of those have anything to do with the end user's experience, which is what really matters.
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1. Yes, that one may be me nitpicking. But I like to have my navigation a certain way (I blame my OCD), and it is the main thing the end user uses when on the site. But there are certain things I would like the user to see first, for example with my site I would like to let them see the links to my reviews and gallery sections before they even get to the forum link because the first two will be the main draw to my site. However with the way things are set now, I can't even really move either because they are addons and addons are stuck in certain parts of the navigation menu with other addons that I don't want to show until the end of the navigation.

2 & 3. They may not help the end user much, but they make things easier for the admin, which in turn allows him to create a better end-user experience for his members.

4. See my other posts on this.

5. Just a personal preference I guess, but I really wouldn't want my users creating polls with every post they make. :)

6. I'm sure a lot of admins will agree with that one.
 
Bryan Gilchrist said:
1. Yes, that one may be me nitpicking. But I like to have my navigation a certain way (I blame my OCD), and it is the main thing the end user uses when on the site. But there are certain things I would like the user to see first, for example with my site I would like to let them see the links to my reviews and gallery sections before they even get to the forum link because the first two will be the main draw to my site. However with the way things are set now, I can't even really move either because they are addons and addons are stuck in certain parts of the navigation menu with other addons that I don't want to show until the end of the navigation.

2 & 3. They may not help the end user much, but they make things easier for the admin, which in turn allows him to create a better end-user experience for his members.

4. See my other posts on this.

5. Just a personal preference I guess, but I really wouldn't want my users creating polls with every post they make. :)

6. I'm sure a lot of admins will agree with that one.
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I also have my navigation how I want it and yes it was a slight pain to get it like that. However it's not something that I'm changing every week (or even year for that matter), so it wasn't that bad.

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tab2.webp

2. XF isn't a blog or CMS, it's a forum, so having 100+ pages isn't really ideal.

4. That's your opinion.

5. Remove the poll options from the forums you don't want via a conditional. Yes a slight pain to setup but how many times do you really plan on changing it?

6. There are cons to just uploading a .zip file. (I personally don't care either way)
 
1. Understandably I can do what you suggested, but the average forum admin is going to look at that and say "I have to do WHAT to change my navigation menu around??". It's a selling point. :)

2. I was using 100 as an example, and perhaps an extreme one that... :P

4. I'll give you that.

5. See #1. One shouldn't have to use conditionals to turn off an option on their site while there are checkboxes to turn off others.

6. There are also cons to doing it the way it is done now, but the more steps you have, the greater the chance of someone screwing one of those steps up.

While some of us may be familiar with coding and the like, not every admin is going to know how to add conditionals or how to edit listeners, or even know what a listener is. Just thinking of the average admin that may be considering using Xenforo. What may be easy for you may not be easy for others.
 
Bryan Gilchrist said:
1. Understandably I can do what you suggested, but the average forum admin is going to look at that and say "I have to do WHAT to change my navigation menu around??". It's a selling point. :)

2. I was using 100 as an example, and perhaps an extreme one that... :p

4. I'll give you that.

5. See #1. One shouldn't have to use conditionals to turn off an option on their site while there are checkboxes to turn off others.

6. There are also cons to doing it the way it is done now, but the more steps you have, the greater the chance of someone screwing one of those steps up.

While some of us may be familiar with coding and the like, not every admin is going to know how to add conditionals or how to edit listeners, or even know what a listener is. Just thinking of the average admin that may be considering using Xenforo. What may be easy for you may not be easy for others.
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From what I've seen the average admin tends to leave it as it is, a lot of times that includes the default style.

5. The reason you have to use conditionals is because there is no option to turn off polls to begin with. Conditionals are very powerful and useful, for example I use a number of them to control my chat box. It can be turned on/off via a check box in your user preferences and this check box doesn't appear until you've reached an X posts and likes. None of those options are part of the chat addon.
 
I agree that conditionals are good for that (I plan on using them to display certain ads in certain forums), but - like I said - you shouldn't have to use conditionals to turn off a feature that's a core part of the software when other core features can be turned off by simply selecting a check box. This is why I think Xenforo falls short in some areas.

Now if I want to customize, or build upon, said core features, then that's when conditionals, callbacks and listeners should come in to play.
 
Bryan Gilchrist said:
Now if I want to customize, or build upon, said core features, then that's when conditionals, callbacks and listeners should come in to play.
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Removing or changing poll options, to make them different from the core, is customising core features.
 
Brogan said:
Removing or changing poll options, to make them different from the core, is customising core features.
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Understandable, but the only option I have right now with respects to poll permissions is whether or not a usergroup can vote on said polls. I can't turn them on or off on a per forum basis (or all together), I can't control who can start polls, etc., all the while other core features of the site have several options available for them. That's the point I am trying to make. IMHO, these options should be a core feature and shouldn't be something I have to use custom programming for. Custom programming should be for enhancing polls, not doing something a core feature should do, like turn them on or off.
 
Bryan Gilchrist said:
Let me just start out by saying I am not here to bash Xenforo. I love it, I see a lot of potential in it and I am going to use it for a site I am launching on February 1 and, if all goes well, I will be purchasing and using it on many other sites that I run as well. I also understand that the issue between Xenforo and vBS/IB most likely put a damper on a lot of development along the way.

That being said, since I've had some time to tinker around with it while getting my initial Xenforo site ready and have found a few areas where Xenforo falls short:

  1. Navigation - This is my biggest issue with Xenforo right now. It is nearly impossible to set up the navigation the way I want it because some of the navigation items are trapped in for/next loops, and to extract them would take recoding things, and I really don't want to do that because it may end up screwing something up down the line. What's even worse is that I can edit the Administrative navigation via my ACP (in Debug mode), but I can't edit my front-end navigation menu. Navigation should be straight-forward, not stuck in code.
  2. Pages - Pages should be pages, not nodes, and they should be separate from the node list. In fact, they should have their own area on the Admin menu. 90% of the time, pages will most likely be tied to menu item at the top or bottom of the page, or will be called on their own, so there's no reason to tie them to the node list. What's going to happen when I have 100 pages and 100 forums? I'm going to go crazy looking for one page. Furthermore, pages should be editable just like threads. I shouldn't have to use HTML code. I should just be able to add a title and enter my page using the WYSIWYG edtior.
  3. Help Pages - These should be added under the Pages section I mentioned above. Additionally, I shouldn't have to install an addon or edit templates and code just to add a single help page. It's almost like people are putting these addons out as "workarounds" to core functions that should already be in the software.
  4. Applications - There should be an easier way to install applications, like uploading a zip file. Having to FTP folders and then upload an XML file is so 2005. ;) Uninstalling them should be just as easy.
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1. Organizing the menu is sorely needed in Xenforo. It is currently available in vBulletin though. It really sucks trying to organize the menu the way you want in Xenforo but here are some... alternatives:
http://xenforo.com/community/resources/forum-jump-menu-by-waindigo.2391/
http://xenforo.com/community/resources/nodes-as-tabs.9/

2 & 3) I use Showcase by @Bob B for my pages and help pages.

4. I use @Waindigo install and upgrade addon. It installs both addons, styles and xenforo upgrades
http://xenforo.com/community/resources/install-and-upgrade-by-waindigo.2035/

@Chris Deeming also has one: http://xenforo.com/community/resources/add-on-install-upgrade.960/
 
Polls do really lack in XenForo compared to other competitors, that's one thing XenForo really lags behind in.

The ability to add a poll to an existing thread,
Ability for users to change votes,
Ability to restrict poll creations in certain forums,
Ability to restrict exact number of options that can be voted on (instead of just one or all)

It will improve, but the sooner the better. There are add-ons of course that handles these things, but these features are requested by many and part of core in other products and should be in XenForo as well.
 
Well I agree with the topic starter. It's a good product, but when you have a large forum you need to use a lot of addons to manage it. And I think large forums are the best publicity for XenForo. Something really simple that I see missing is default option to have a link on all pages to a privacy policy. A need when using Google products like adsense and analytics.

We as forum owners have to compete to the social media sites where people ask their questions and collaborate. They used to do this at forums, and we need therefore the best product available.

I was wondering, I could not find this on the site, but how big is the current development team? Number of persons in FTE? As I can see the past release cycle on wikipedia, there is quitte some time between 1.x releases.
 
Thanks, I was hoping there would be more developers. It has pro's and con's such a small team. Only 2 is quitte risky, what if there is a disagreement or one gets sick (worst case scenarios, but never say never). The pro is I know these guys are really good from their work at vB. They have quality as a real priority over quick earnings.

Still really in doubt about making the migration to XenForo. Not happy with the path vB has chosen, but I have been using it since 2.x. Maybe wait it out to see if 1.3 brings me more ease of mind. I think if the development team would be bigger and more work could be done it can and will be easy the best choice.
 
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woei said:
Thanks, I was hoping there would be more developers. It has pro's and con's such a small team. Only 2 is quitte risky, what if there is a disagreement or one gets sick (worst case scenarios, but never say never). The pro is I know these guys are really good from their work at vB. They have quality as a real priority over quick earnings.

Still really in doubt about making the migration to XenForo. Not happy with the path vB has chosen, but I have been using it since 2.x. Maybe wait it out to see if 1.3 brings me more ease of mind. I think if the development team would be bigger and more work could be done it can and will be easy the best choice.
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Having more developers doesn't necessarily mean more work could get done. Look at vBulletin, for example. IB had a fairly large team of developers and look where they are now...Mike and Kier know XenForo inside and out. They've been able to get quite a bit done in a little bit of time. Now that the threat of a lawsuit isn't lingering over them, I expect that to continue.
 
jmurrayhead said:
Having more developers doesn't necessarily mean more work could get done. Look at vBulletin, for example. IB had a fairly large team of developers and look where they are now...Mike and Kier know XenForo inside and out. They've been able to get quite a bit done in a little bit of time. Now that the threat of a lawsuit isn't lingering over them, I expect that to continue.
Click to expand...

Not necessarily, but it would be logical. And I don't think we should compare them to IB, Kier and Mike do have a vision and knowledge of what needs to be done. The fact remains, with proper guidance it will make a difference. It's not meant to criticise them, but as a potential customer I want to express my thoughts on this matter.
 
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