DragonByte Tech add-ons not coming to XF anytime soon

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DragonByte Tech said:
If you can come up with a way to come across as humble on the internet while conveying the level of your success i'm all ears - genuinely. It's really hard to do in my experience.
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You can tell us how long you've been in business, how many years experience your team has together, the successful people that use your plugins(like on your site). It just doesn't seem in good taste to basically shove the IPB marketplace down the drain as you've done with XF as well.
 
Russ said:
You can tell us how long you've been in business, how many years experience your team has together, the successful people that use your plugins(like on your site). It just doesn't seem in good taste to basically shove the IPB marketplace down the drain as you've done with XF as well.
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I used IPB as the measuring stick because it's been brought up several times in this thread, so it's a measure most people will be familiar with and a good common point of comparison.
 
DRE said:
How much do you think you'd make on Xenforo in 30 months, about... two years from now if you do decide to develop for Xenforo? Guesstimate.
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You mean based on how i expect the market to be in 2 years, or how much would we have done in 30 months starting from now?
 
People here simply won't see things from the same point of view as DBTech, and it's quite nice of him to even engage people on this topic here. His statements are coming from experience, trial and error from a logical business operation perspective. Your demands are coming from your gut and how you feel things should be, a completely emotional outer perspective with no directly relevant logic. Not busting on anyone here as there is a time and place for everything, but this is just silly.

Rather than sit here and write 10 paragraphs on this to prove this point, you can look back at the last few pages of the topic. It's a circular thing:

Member: Make XenForo plugins because I know will be good for me. If you get lucky, it will be good for your business too.
DBTech: <knows the validity of statement #2>
DBTech: ...
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vbresults said:
People here simply won't see things from the same point of view as DBTech, and it's quite nice of him to even engage people on this topic here.
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I think you missed part of the equation there...


A few users who still live in vBland headspace: ask for XYZ mod by DBT
DBT: Thanks but no Thanks.
Few users: continue asking.
Majority Says: who cares, move on.
 
I am looking forward to see some mods being ported over to XenForo from Dbtech.

The mods that dbtech released a while back were not their prime mods, that's the reason why they didn't do well.
I am sure it would be a different story if they released dbtech credits II or dbtech shop or dbtech shoutbox and dbtech vbdonate...
 
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Kim said:
I think you missed part of the equation there...


A few users who still live in vBland headspace: ask for XYZ mod by DBT
DBT: Thanks but no Thanks.
Few users: continue asking.
Majority Says: who cares, move on.
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:) Our response in this thread hasn't been thanks but no thanks, it's been we're gathering as much information and data as possible to make an informed decision, we're appreciative of the people who are providing us with that information in this thread and sharing their opinions with us. Here's our overarching logic and reasoning behind our decision making process for you guys to see so you can get an idea of the process behind making the decision.

I don't understand why people who don't care keep posting in this thread and the other thread related to us though. Surely if they didn't care they wouldn't be wasting time doing that? I don't suppose you could explain to me why someone who is neutral/doesn't care feels the need to post several times stating how much they don't care?
 
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DRE said:
Jaxel's making a killing off his copyrighted addons to the point that he can pull some Sony Other OS stuff and remove features that originally came with the product.
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You might want to ask Jason about these facts, considering he has been said quite the opposite most of the time, to the point he has now released his further releases as paid products, because people weren't supporting his free development via copyright removal.
 
DragonByte Tech said:
I would estimate vBulletin's paid market to be at least double that size, potentially several times larger.
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VB's community, thus developers as well, has been declining steadily for years now. VB5 hammered the nail a bit further, with more boards stepping away from them towards IPB and XF. VB are not futuristic... IPB and XF are the future of forum software, as they're the only ones truly developing for the market.
 
Anthony Parsons said:
VB's community, thus developers as well, has been declining steadily for years now. VB5 hammered the nail a bit further, with more boards stepping away from them towards IPB and XF. VB are not futuristic... IPB and XF are the future of forum software, as they're the only ones truly developing for the market.
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Do you have any figures/data to back that up? It's strongly at odds with the data I have and the continuing growth we're experiencing at DBTech. I've heard people say vB is dying for a couple of years now, yet the number of new vB users hasn't slowed on DBTech - and note that's new vB users, not new customers which is a completely different metric. I've also noticed no decline in the number of sites running vBulletin on the web, though admittedly tracking THAT metric is extremely tricky and can be very imprecise.
 
DragonByte Tech said:
Thirdly, xenForo will be unprofitable for us in the short term for sure, probably in the medium term and very possibly in the long term.
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Unless my Business degree studies serve me wrong, it would be pretty odd for a company that has stated it is a non-profitable market to the turn around and pursue it anyway.

That reads like a "Thanks but no Thanks" to me.

You've stated your case, it's not for you right now, why do YOU keep further posting your justifications of that.

Regardless, one thing you are perfectly right about, I have wasted enough time in this thread.

Good day to you, best of luck with your endeavours.
 
Kim said:
Unless my Business degree studies serve me wrong, it would be pretty odd for a company that has stated it is a non-profitable market to the turn around and pursue it anyway.

That reads like a "Thanks but no Thanks" to me.

You've stated your case, it's not for you right now, why do YOU keep further posting your justifications of that.

Regardless, one thing you are perfectly right about, I have wasted enough time in this thread.

Good day to you, best of luck with your endeavours.
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Your business degree should allow you to appreciate that a lack of short term profitability can be overlooked if there is a belief of long-term profitability, especially where that profitability is tied to a product or service you believe to have the potential to be the market leader over the long term. Taking a hit short term for potential long term gain is a common business practice, I am surprised they didn't teach you that.

My posts in the thread have been discussing the barriers to LONG term profitability, the obstacles in the way of developing the market over the medium to long term to ensure a profitable environment in future and weighing up the probability of each outcome based on the available information relating to all of the relevant factors.
 
Anthony Parsons said:
You might want to ask Jason about these facts, considering he has been said quite the opposite most of the time, to the point he has now released his further releases as paid products, because people weren't supporting his free development via copyright removal.
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Man I don't care I'm just glad he added the old school recent news block back. :LOL:
 
DragonByte Tech said:
we're gathering as much information and data as possible to make an informed decision, we're appreciative of the people who are providing us with that information in this thread
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Speaking of info, check out the big boards list: http://xenforo.com/community/threads/the-big-forum-list.26352/

We've got sites like www.IGN.com who have jumped on board the Xenforo wagon http://www.alexa.com/siteinfo/ign.com#

http://www.ign.com/boards/

We've got digital point. https://forums.digitalpoint.com/

Great Reviews: http://xenforo.com/community/threads/xenforo-review-by-forum-software-org.41478/

K I'm done.
 
DRE said:
As in how much do you think you would be making in a 30 month period off Xenforo, two years from now?
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Hard to judge that far ahead, especially considering 5 and a half years from now we'll be on a different version of xF entirely and the landscape could look VERY different. Still if we go ahead and assume linearity then i'd say about $100-120k in a 30 month period based on what I think xFs market will look like in 2 years.

If it was a 30 month period starting now, we're probably looking at $50-60k

I knew about IGN and DP, IGN were one of the very first on board and xF seems to have struggled a bit since then to keep picking up the big clients in the same way vB does. We don't really need convinced about the quality of the software - we're well aware of that ;)
 
DragonByte Tech said:
It wasn't discontinued due to lack of demand - it was discontinued because we couldn't verify that licensing work for various pieces of content had been handled properly by the people who should have done it. We discontinued it to protect ourselves legally. Support was still provided for it and bugfixes were still made - still are to this day if anyone reported any.



Trust me, I know for an absolute fact the paid vBulletin market is worth several times more than the IPB Market.

For everything I hear about vBulletin dying, our numbers disagree. The number of people newly using vBulletin and buying mods for the first time is still growing, and we actually had our most profitable week of all time 4 weeks ago. Being free for custom work and there being custom work at a price-point suitable for us are two very different propositions. If Chris or Waindigo are making $30 per hour+ for their xenForo work i'd be very surprised (that's the basic wage for a PHP programmer job). If they're willing to share details of their xenForo income i'd be very grateful and interested in hearing those. Data like that is crucial in making proper decisions from a fiscal perspective.
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Long time no see Decado (former inferno customer here):D

I can't speak from a coders point of view, (as while i code a little its freelance between my main job and not for a living) however I do "broker" for a large client who hires xenforo dev's for custom work, and while i will not name names and break confidentiality, i would be doing backflips if i could find a coder willing to work for $30 an hour for xenforo, We have paid before and continue to do so upwards of $80-$100 per hour, and would gladly do so again (that's even after the non profit discount , since my client is a non profit)
 
DragonByte Tech said:
Out of curiosity, since you're apparently a coder and seem to have things figured out, would you be kind enough to share how much you make from your xF work? If you want it kept private i'm fine with you PMing it :)
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Sure. But before... for my consultancy to you, I charge an initial flat-fee of $499 which covers 30 minutes of my highly valuable time. Every additional 30 minutes is $199. To you accept PayPal?
 
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