you can't speak on his behalf, so how about we leave it up to him to decide
There we go.
Current Litigation
- Thread starter JamesBrown
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majdi
Well-known member
thanks for answering
Fred Sherman
Well-known member
No, but I can speak from experience, having endured a similar experience. This isn't just business when you are the accused, its personal because it calls into question your honesty and integrity. What ends up at stake isn't revenue and income. Those can be replaced. Its your reputation, which is the most valuable commodity one posesses in the business world. I first came here because of Kier's stellar reputation. I stated, because it remains well deserved.
When I was in a similar position, it hurts. You want to climb to the highest montain top and defend yourself in loud voice. I was told that I would be tried and found guilty and innocence many times over in the court of public opinion before I ever appeared before a judge. I'm sure Kier can relate.
The advice I was given was simple. If you defend yourself against public opinion, you will surely lose in court.
So yes, I cannot speak on his behalf. But I can speak on behalf of those who support him, his reputation and the fine work that has and will continue to fuel it and ask that we don't make this any harder of him that it already is.
Besides, he has the power to ban me if he dislikes what I say, so...
I for one welcome our new xenForo Overlords.
When I was in a similar position, it hurts. You want to climb to the highest montain top and defend yourself in loud voice. I was told that I would be tried and found guilty and innocence many times over in the court of public opinion before I ever appeared before a judge. I'm sure Kier can relate.
The advice I was given was simple. If you defend yourself against public opinion, you will surely lose in court.
So yes, I cannot speak on his behalf. But I can speak on behalf of those who support him, his reputation and the fine work that has and will continue to fuel it and ask that we don't make this any harder of him that it already is.
Besides, he has the power to ban me if he dislikes what I say, so...
I for one welcome our new xenForo Overlords.
HannahP
Well-known member
I don't think I would expend as much energy on this as some of you have even if the suit was filed against me personally. Some of you motherf'ers need to get a job and quit fooling around!
If not, I'll turn this forum around and take every one of you right back home! Is that what you want? No? Then you'd better behave! I'm not kidding.
All right. Glad that's settled.
Not quite sure what they'd do without me around here.
If not, I'll turn this forum around and take every one of you right back home! Is that what you want? No? Then you'd better behave! I'm not kidding.
All right. Glad that's settled.
Not quite sure what they'd do without me around here.
jmurrayhead
Well-known member
Now I had a brain fart
Anthony Parsons
Well-known member
Now that is some good info... thanks jadmperry and mgsteve, much appreciated.
Itworx4me
Well-known member
Lets just say worst case scenario and IB wins the case in California. How are they going to force Kier and Xenforo to comply with the ruling? The US court system doesn't have jurisdiction in another country. So unless Kier and Xenforo move to the US. I don't see how they could ever hold them to any type of ruling. It really puzzles me why they even had to hire a law firm to defend them in the US when they clearly are from the UK. Is there some international law that governs this type of lawsuit?
Itworx4me
Itworx4me
ManagerJosh
Well-known member
Money. Stop sales in the US.
Itworx4me
Well-known member
I find this highly unlikely to happen. How in the world would they stop people from buying there Product?
HydraulicJack
Well-known member
...Because there's at least some possibility that at least some of the people pushing these lawsuits may have a sociopathic personality.
Brain blood-flow studies have shown that for classic sociopaths, (see pp 125 and 126 from that link) when presented with stimuli that involve morality or compassion, the parts of the brain that light up (i.e. have increased blood flow) in compassionate people, simply do not do so in a sociopath.
Basically, a lizard brain... Appeals based on morality or doing the right thing literally do not compute, for such people.
Cognitively, their brain doesn't go there... Translation, they sleep just fine at night.
Anthony Parsons
Well-known member
The answer is a few pages back... asked the same thing: http://xenforo.com/community/threads/current-litigation.7568/page-38#post-157370
ManagerJosh
Well-known member
In theory, a judgement could be imposed on any major company to prohibit sales. Essentially, you prohibit companies like VISA, MasterCard, American Express, Discover, PayPal, First Data, Paymenttech, etc. (all these are credit cards and credit card processors) from sending money to xenForo and there you go.
Ati
Well-known member
There are plenty of other companies outside the US that can process payments: Moneybookers, Worldpay etc.
TheLaw
Well-known member
Guys... we are a long, long way from even thinking about worst case scenarios. There doesn't appear to be much of a dispute at all when it comes down to discussing the actual merits, much of which is obvious puffing. The troubling aspect is that IB intends to spend millions to get to that ultimate conclusion and cause everyone pain and unnecessary expense, except for their lawyers.
Jose Amaral Mota
Active member
This all quite normal and most Judges that do not have extensive knowledge in this area. Most likely would like to here this out or if it can be proven that each part of IB points are flawed, then IB would either still proceed with its case or settle out and or still get everything dismissed later.
CTXMedia
Well-known member
The irony in all of this is that IB has a number of on-going legal claims against them and you don't see threads on vB.com with people holding off buying a license.
If you're reading this and ummm'ing and ahhhhh'ing - just get yourself an xF license, get your site up and running, get some ads on it, and there's every chance you'll earn your license fee back before this even gets to trial (if ever!!).
Cheers,
Shaun
If you're reading this and ummm'ing and ahhhhh'ing - just get yourself an xF license, get your site up and running, get some ads on it, and there's every chance you'll earn your license fee back before this even gets to trial (if ever!!).
Cheers,
Shaun
Saeed
Well-known member
Very very VERY true!
TheLaw
Well-known member
Most won't usually waste their time if they find out that a plaintiff has filed two virtually identical claims and virtually the entire series of events occurred in another jurisdiction, which is where most of the witnesses and evidence is. Curiosity shouldn't be a reason to decide not to move the lawsuit to one place so the parties can fight it out fairly. These things cost a great deal of money and, for many, their entire life savings could be at stake financing a whim. There is also something about judicial precedent that should be followed. That said, I really don't know why Judge Real decided that concurrent jurisdiction was appropriate. We'll have to wait to see what his reasoning was before coming to any firm conclusions.
F
Floris
Guest
People can claim anything, they have to provide reasonable evidence I assume?. They can't ask Kier & Party to incriminate themselves providing a range of data so the plaintiffs can go dive through it to find anything to incriminate Kier & Party with. They have to be specific. The pdf files shared by Shamil don't include any evidence besides a whiteboard with scribbles. That whiteboard does not have source code on it, nor does it seems to be supporting any other claims; And is filled with terms that are known to be industry standards. Withholding evidence is not legal I am sure, so I am wondering how they are going to actually support their claims with evidence if they haven't filed it (yet?). In a pre-trial or trial case, they can't have claims without evidence. Maybe that's just what the Judge was looking for, do these claims have any merit to go through with.
I am also curious to hear certain people, they've mentioned to be employees and present at the meeting, explain themselves if they were not employed by Jelsoft or vBulletin Solutions Inc (which came to life AFTER the meeting took place), and if they weren't there, how were they there. And if they were there, why were they participating in a private meeting where the trade secrets were shared, or the future of the company was being discussed. They never signed any NDA I am sure, especially if they weren't there. Perhaps the XFL attorney is curious to request the notes these team members made? I dunno.
It's shaky on many grounds and they are technicalities I am confident will end up costing IB the lawsuit.
As worried as I am that this whole thing is a money pit, there are two law suits after all, everything they do, kinda has to be done in double. But if Kier & Party know they didn't do anything claimed against them, and they are confident IB can't make it to court, and even so, nothing comes from it and gets ruled in the favor of Kier and / or XFL, then the prospect of a successful company in the future (see what happened with Jelsoft, worth 25 million after just 6 years) then I can imagine the brits might say: Steady on then.
That's my observation of the situation, and the opinion I created of that observation.
DoctorWatsOn
Well-known member
There have been some excellent posts recently and Floris is right about evidence, we don't seem to have seen ANY yet, just claims.
What they need to do now is come up with the evidence to back-up those claims otherwise the action(s) will not move forward, just how the hell are they going to come up with evidence for most, if not all, of those claims, when most, if not all, seem totally detached from any reality known to man?
EDIT: And thinking about it, if I were in the shoes of the various managers at IB right now, I would actually be crapping myself and losing sleep over how the hell I could come up with evidence to support such wild claims.
Whereas I can't help thinking Kier, Mike & Ashley are fairly relaxed about it all, despite it being constantly in the back of their minds, because they know IB can't.
What they need to do now is come up with the evidence to back-up those claims otherwise the action(s) will not move forward, just how the hell are they going to come up with evidence for most, if not all, of those claims, when most, if not all, seem totally detached from any reality known to man?
EDIT: And thinking about it, if I were in the shoes of the various managers at IB right now, I would actually be crapping myself and losing sleep over how the hell I could come up with evidence to support such wild claims.
Whereas I can't help thinking Kier, Mike & Ashley are fairly relaxed about it all, despite it being constantly in the back of their minds, because they know IB can't.
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